Linda Stokke: welcome to the blog. You have raised a point I think worth answering: "wishing such ill will upon the leaders of your own country". When I first started posting to this blog, I was very careful to never be disrespectful of anyone in office. I always used appropriate titles and never used dismissive language. That slowly became subject to my rage at the abuses I see in our national government, specifically the present administration. I do think we go overboard in our language sometime in that area. I know I do. My only excuse is that Mr. Bush and his administration have been so disrespectful of the country and its constution that I get carried away. I don't know that I will be able to completely change my language specifically about Mr. Bush but I do think that it dilutes my arguments when I slip into such casual harshness and will try to change that. Now about each of the other points you raise. Pehaps you can help me understand what you are saying if I misunderstand: "Wow, are you people for real? What world do you live in? Do you sleep with your night-lights on or perhaps you check under your bed before you get in. And don’t forget to check your phone it might be tapped! You bunch of stinking hypocrites, so full of hatred for your fellow Americans." Well, no to the nightlights and bed checks. Doesn't help to check the phone as my outrage in that regard has less to do with the actual eavesdropping as with the broad net of data collection used in data mining to target investigations prior to any indication of guilt. Please explain how you have detected hypocrisy and to what "fellow Americans" we are showing hatred. (I have already agreed about the language toward office holders.) ---- "Since when did it become the norm to insult and slam people who are guilty of nothing more then having different opinion then your own. Or is that the way you practice tolerance and acceptance?" --I think if you read the entirety of this specific item under the Countdown blog, you'll see that we've alread decided to be extremely careful in expressing our views in respect for other bloggers. If, however, you are talking about expressing extreme opinions about those who have published opinions or who hold elected office, we welcome those from any position. It need not mesh with our own. I have repeatedly requested that someone from more conservative viewpoints tell me things that they are proud of in that side of the aisle. We don't hear that often. We hear more complaints than defence.--"Have you ever thought perhaps the people in power are privileged to a little more security information then the average citizen? Yes, indeed. In fact, what I can't understand if why we seem to know more than the administration, as recent revelations have made clear. My only conclusion is that we have been lied to. I am not willing under any circumstances to just "trust" anyone in office. Regardless of party affiliations. I want to know that they are actually making use of information available and are using only constitution-provided methods to obtain that information and execute policy based on it and that it has nothing to do with Democratic or Republican party requirements.---Have you ever given thought to the fact there are really people who hate all of us just for being Americans?" All the time. I'm scared to death. ---"Why would anyone ever side with people who wish to harm your own country?" Please explain to me why you think anyone here is siding with our enemies. I really don't understand that connection. Please help me understand what you mean.----"I don’t care who the president is, Republican or Democrat; there is no reason to wish such ill will upon the leaders of your own country and spread outright lies." I already spoke about the "ill will" part. Help me understand what lies you think are being spread. Thanks for your post. I hope to hear more from you.

Linda Stokke - I'm sorry I misspoke. Our efforts to improve the conduct on the blog are in another thread not this one. Perhaps you could go to the "Fighting Them There" thread to see those discussions. They are really feisty!

Linda Stokke, Kent, WA; Sounds like it's you who is afraid, sleeping with "your" night light, checking under "your" bed, if you have read anything here you would know it's not the people in this blog who are afraid, as that's what this thread is about. It's people like you who have fallen for the Administration's scare tactic's, i'll give you the phone tap thingy, that's a real good possibility. The fellow american's you speak of here are the Bush Administration, they are the one's that have insulted and slammed the "American People" by implying that any one who disagrees with them, support the terrorist, but are in fact, guilty of nothing more then having a difference in opinion other than the Administration's! You state, have you ever thought perhap's that the people in power are privileged to a little more security information than the average American, "you would think so" but they abused that privilage by "lying" to, and using fear "against" the American people to push their agenda. You speak of tolerance and acceptance and pretend to denounce hate, but then that's what you have brought in here, against the bloger's, what would that make you?

Linda Stokke Kent WA,... just a wee bit naive..... Look up the defintion of lie in your dictionary: ..mine has a picture of the entire Bush Administration Smiling:),if they are so trustworthy and priviledged to the information and "top secrets" why do they leak it like news to the "National Enquire" everytime it's conveinent politically or for any reason to "their" goals not the nations.Kind of defies the words "Top Secret".Cheney and Rove are suspected, highly,level red suspected of having leaked the identity of one agent with regards her and husband being at odds with the administrations war agenda and proof of nulear WMD.Ever hear of Valerie Palme Wilson and her husband Joe.They can tell you all that works.I like the guy Keith O. has on here sometime retired CIA fellow Larry Johnson,who calledd one of the Bush liars a " that twit" one time.We still laugh about that around here.Ask them about the facts or go visit some veterans hospital and ask someone there who blind or can't walk or is burned beyond recognition, about the facts and will live like that till they die and give them your ole speech about what's going on in Iraq?.Ask some Iraqi child,woman,man,or orphan,who have felt the affects of this about the facts.Just the facts of a 432 billion dollar "no new taxes deficit" you'll here in the up coming election, that you and your children and grand children will get to pay for with "no new taxes election talk" about the facts.No coverage the bombed maimed and wounded to stop this war because of its horror about the facts.Sneak the dead flag draped coffins in the back doors of Dover Air Field so we don't see the ugliness about the facts.Ask C A about the facts,ask the kid who visits these posts from Baghdad,Iraq about the facts who is in the service.The dead aren't coming back.In a couple years Dubya and the Wife will be on the ranch drinking Lone Stars and not feeling one bit of remorse or giving a shit that any of this happened.Don't tell folks on here about the facts or them slamming some cruel bastard and his cronies that has cost thousands of lives and are bankrupting this country like everything else he has touched financially.Have him pick your stocks then short them.By the way my son has a Purple Heart that is a fact.He didn't serve in the Texas Air National Guard that is a fact.He did get wounded by and IED that is a fact.As far as wishing ill.No we are wishing well for the Country and for the guys behind this to be impeached about lying to involve a nation in war.There seems to be something that just defies being an American about that,and because of it we have managed to piss off a lot of people around the world.As for Bush,Laura and that hole "sick bunch" need every prayer they can get,Muslim,Buddhist,Zen,Unity,Great Spirit,Catholic,Christian,Runes,Bones,Astrology,and every connection with the cosmic creator available.I don't have the inside track like he does in the "Rose Garden" and all,but I think by now the Karma Mamma's list is getting fairly long and heavy.That's giving them a lot more slack than have given a lot of folks.Ask a GI about the puny .5 of 3.5% missing from his check. I do care who my President IS because I want one who dosen't spread outright lies with his administration and misleads a Country into a War.

The war on terror is a hoax. I don't believe anyone is actually fearful when a story like this is released, except maybe the dumbest, most uninformed of people (that would be FOX News watchers). Whenever you hear of some "plot" being broken up, it is because an informant or an agent has "infiltrated" then suggested the plot, leading all the "conspirators" exactly where the Bush government would like them to go, sometimes even providing the materials needed to do the job. Check your history. This is exactly what happened with the '93 WTC bombing. An FBI agent procured the bomb-making materials, provided the van to place the explosives in, formulated the plan, etc. And who is in prison for this crime? Not the agent that was responsible for the bombing! Same thing with Ruby Ridge, Waco and Oklahoma City. Homegrown terrorists? You bet they are. Government sponsored and sanctioned. Hello!!?? Wake up, America!!!

Nice comment Linda and very true.

Cliff from Ill. nice blog totally agree with you on the loss of jobs , manufacturing, technology etc. Its happened in the last 30 years and no one has done anything to stop it. Lee Iacocca said it best we are going to be selling each other hamburgers and insurance. Disagree on Olberfrau's defense of the constitution. Would like to see him tackle your issue instead. Much more important than the fate of a jihadist at G-mo.

We are living in a time of "Project Fear" where fear seems to out weigh common sense, as americans we deserve much better from our elected officials, we have become a nation of saber rattlers and provocateurs instead of a nation of peace this is not what our founding fathers invisioned for our great nation. Whwn this nation was founded is was founded on the Idea of a democratic republic, and some how the Idea was lost what better way to divide a country than to divide the politics.

Linda Stokke, Kent: When is the privilege of having a little more security information justification to throw young troops into a policing action where they cannot always identify their enemy, rarely identify the bombs that go off and take their limbs, or try and train the same persons during the day that become your bomb makers and informants at night. "I do care who the President is". I don't want a man with a child's mind who has not experienced such war-time conditions, nor has a clue what an immoral and ill-conceived practice it is to send young people into such conditions. And to assume you do know (because you have the privilege of having a little more security intelligence than others) is a cheap, ignorant and frankly criminalistic attitude and mindset (coupled witha smirk that really says I know I am stupid but I try to hide it). As an American, a verteran who supports our troops (especially their well-being and ability to fight a real war when necessary to protect this country), I have every damn right to ridicule, slam and challenge this sorry excuse for a President and administration. Oh, and by the way, yes there are people who hate America. There will always be people who hate those with super=power status and who flaunt their wealth and especially their power throughout the world. And we, under this stupid and ugly, yes ugly administration, have been doing a pretty good job of that in the last few years. This administration has doubled our enemies by their very smart-a--, ignorant and shove-it-up-your-a-- attitude with others in the world. So take your President with privileged security inteligence and his administration and get the hell out of our way so that we can fix the mess he/they have made of this country and our reltionships with others while we fight terrorism to protect our country the right way before it is too late.

Linda Linda, Linda...We are not Americans we are from Mars and we are here on a SECRECT mission. So please do not scold us as un American, we do not hate you we are here to ...OH just got ....oh you are talking about the REPUBLICANS!! My error I that you were oh never mind ..right on LINDA!! I too HATE them.

Here we go again. I am happy that a plot was recognized, investigated, and broken up. I am disgusted that fellow americans are disrespectful to the hard work of fellow Americans in law enforcement. To Independant in Texas, enough please with the Our Constitution is in tatters and our rights are trampled on. One question. Prove it. Please tell me how because not one person I have know has one example of any privacy or rights of their own being denied, period. Not one or two or any at all. Which of any of yours or any one on this blog has? None.

Larry - Boston: Good question. I agree that we should call people on broad statements. Rather than writing detail about my claims in this area, I refer you to the "Bill of Rights violations blog entry I posted at First Read's blog:http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2007/05/31/209985.aspx#comments. There are follow up comments after the "looonnngg" post that apply as well. Also, see SDE's entry in "Fighting Them There" item on this blog. I've asked that this be reviewed and for people to tell me if I've messed up in reciting what I believe to be those violations. I welcome your review and feedback. Thank you.

Oh goodie - people on the blog who don't realize that the Patriot Act doesn't have anything to do with patriotism and that our constitutional rights have all but disappeared. They are spying on you and me and everyone else in America. Your email - scanned by a data mining computer; your phone calls - ditto; your financial data - ya, that too. Remember the Ashcroft hospital visit? It wasn't to bring him flowers and wish him well after his surgery - it was an attempt to get him to sign off on a continuation of domestic spying that is such an offense to every American that even John Ashcroft refused to sign off on it (interesting that it was so extreme that even an extremist like Ashcroft wouldn't go along with it). We are searched, scanned and examined every time we get on a plane; anti war protestors and administration opponents are routinely placed on No Fly Lists; and the Fear Flag gets raised every time there are questions about the invasion of our privacy or the loss of our rights or when the news cycle starts on a story that the administration wants to distract us from. We can't even get within a mile of any administration official if we wear the wrong t-shirt, carry the wrong sign, or speak anything other than their talking points. I think the only right we have left is the right to not be forced to house British soldiers in our homes. Wake up folks, it's become midnight in America.

Larry Boston: one more thing - violations don't have to happen to me personally or, in fact, to any one I directly know for me to feel outrage. "...if you do this to these the least of us, you do it to me.." Very loose paraphrase of a verse in the New Testament.

Larry/Boston: I can think of several thousand Americans whose rights have been violated by this administration. Those that come to mind immediately whose rights have been violated as human beings and who have the right to expect a fighting chance for some sort of survival are our young military personnel. Those shipped to a country to serve as an occupational police force and who are expected to provide security for the same folks that are making bombs to kill them, acting as enemy informants while at the same time being trained by our troops, and for those embroiled in a civil war brought on by the US invasion. How have their rights been violated. By not being assigned a mission that serves and protects the US where they have a chance to use what they were trained to do. To act as soldiers against an enemy they can see and/or identify, that they can distinguish from the general population and that they have a ghost chance in hell of defeating. Constituional rights? There are rights that run deeper than Constituional Rights. There are the rights our committed US Service personnel have to expect sound and logical leadership and judgement when they are sent away to serve and protect this country. That basic human right to have a chance to live. And this administration has violated these rights. Kind of like the ignorant, stupid and overly-zealous Captains or Lieutenants ordering their units to advance down the middle of a road or pathway in the jungles of Vietnam. And often times their unit's reply, "up yours, we are soldiers but we are not stupid". Believe me, Bush and this administration have unfortunately lasted a lot longer violating these basic rights of survival than did these Captians or Lieutenants.

If Keith who is fighting Bill O. for rating and gets nowhere is the star of MSNBC, then the whole NBC is in trouble. People might listen and watch junkies like Keith on the web, but don't pay any attention to his program on MSNBC. That is why even NBC is last in ranking of major networks. People can see through the cracks of NBC how anti-American this network has become. Keith has ranked Bill O. as worst person on the planet 100 times by now, but still his veiwership compare to Bill is at .02% level. Way to go Keith. The funny thing is MSNBC ranked JFK airport news as the most watched program, and Keith think the plot is not worse discovering. What a contrast between those LeftOver Marxists who write the nightly hot air against Bush for Keith and the real news.

If Keith who is fighting Bill O. for rating and gets nowhere is the star of MSNBC, then the whole NBC is in trouble. People might listen and watch junkies like Keith on the web, but don't pay any attention to his program on MSNBC. That is why even NBC is last in ranking of major networks. People can see through the cracks of NBC how anti-American this network has become. Keith has ranked Bill O. as worst person on the planet 100 times by now, but still his veiwership compare to Bill is at .02% level. Way to go Keith. The funny thing is MSNBC ranked JFK airport news as the most watched program, and Keith think the plot is not worse discovering. What a contrast between those LeftOver Marxists who write the nightly hot air against Bush for Keith and the real news.

Larry in Boston...do you really think the government is going to show and tell us what information they have gathered on us though warrantless searches of our phones, email, and regular mail...the warrantless searches do violate the fourth amendment...you may have heard of it...if not, "the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probably cause." If you or your friends have flown in the last four years, all your/their information is now in a flying habits data base...surely you or someone you know has flown...you can look it up Larry...and don't expect a register letter for the government stating the information was gathered illegally..are you really that naive Larry? There is a documented case of an organization, American Friends Service Committee, a nonviolent organization, who had four FBI agents show up in Colorado and question them about why they wanted to assemble at the 2004 RNC...the first amendment is suppose to guarantee citizens the right to peacefully assemble and the right to address grievances against the government...the FBI agents asked Sarah Bardwell, a member of the group and college student “Are you planning to be involved in any criminal acts at the national convention? Are you aware that if you assist or know anybody planning any criminal acts and do not report them, it’s a crime?” How did the FBI know the group was going to assemble? Why did the FBI feel it had to threaten the group into not exercising its first amendment rights? Was it because they wanted to picket the RNC? Another example of the first amendment being abused during Bushworld...here's a link to the article...http://www.wsws.org/articles/2005/may2005/aclu-m20.shtml....I can go on and on Larry...even our Google searches are being tracked...did you read about all the abuses of the Patriot Act by the FBI? Do you really think the abuses have stopped after the slap on the wrist? Read Bush's signing statements that state he can ignore the laws of Congress...another violation of the constitution...here's a grea link...http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2006/04/30/bush_challenges_hundreds_of_laws/.....as for precedence in our country of the constitution being raped, how about the four students killed at Kent State?...how about the 110,000 Japanese citizens placed in internment camps without due process?...habeas corpus was repealed for those 110,000 people...no habeas corpus for the four dead college students...what happened to the students' first amendment rights of peacefully assembly and the right to express their grievances against the government Larry?...our country has raped the constitution before...and Bushworld is raping it now...wake up Larry...

Kourosh-Detroit: Detroit is cool. Like the Tigers and Pistons and Red Wings. But Kourosh, after reading your post I was wondering who writes the hot-air against Bush sentiments for 70% + of the American people who feel he is doing a not-so-good job as President. I undertand that Keith may have ghost-writers for his show and they may lean somewhat to the left, but what of those verbal and written opinions of so many Americans. Are 70 + of Americans LeftOver Marxist? Gosh, if that is true no doubt the Dems will win the 2008 Presidential race by a landslide. Or could it be there is a high percentage of RightWing NeoCons that are abandoning your boy GW. In either case sounds like Keith is right on target with the majority of the Americans, and most likely right on target with the majority of those from Detroit.

George Hammonton - that's great! Would you mind going to the link I provided in my response to Larry? It details each of the rights (along with preceding paragraphs). Your review, correction, agumentation, and general feedback on that would be greatly appreciated. I'm trying to bring it into coherent document form but am waiting for feedback before I do that. The question "How is the Bill of Rights being Violated" is legitimate and we should document specifics somewhere. Thanks,

Who names somebody Scooter? Scooter should dig graves at Arlington with Wolfowitz and Pearl and everyone at the American Enterprise Institute and the Heritage Foundation. Take them out there daily and make them dig graves by hand for the dead G.I.'s they're slaughtering right now in a Sunni slum to steal Iraq's oil reserve. Get them up every day at sunup and make them dig graves on their hands and knees.

Hello Independent Texas...I pasted your post into a word doc...will look it over and make some comments...give me a day or two...not to make your nervous...I was an English professor for twelve years!!! no pressure!!! lol...read the link to Bush's signing statements and ignoring the laws of Congress...truly amazing...talk soon...

CA...my friend...long time no chat...gotta say, I am disappointed in you...I stopped pushing your candidacy for President in 2008 and you disappeared for awhile!!! I was hoping nothing happened or was wrong...glad to see many CA posts again...I got you a beat up ol' farm truck to campaign in...one slight problem...it has farm tags and can only travel for farm business!!! lol...I tried my friend...wanted to say hello...HELLO...enjoy your posts...the revolution starts with you my friend...and the gang of bloggers here...let the revolution begin...glad you are back CA...

This administraton is truely scum. This releasing of terror threats, and supposed foiled terror plots every time the administration's oposition is doing something is so obvious, but alot of people still don't get it. It seems to me that finding convictable crimes committed by this administration is like finding jelly beans in a candy store. When are these newly elected suits gonna take care of this? An unreasonable amount of damage is being done every day Bush is still in office. Keep pointing it out Keith!

Kourash-- Could it be that Fox (as in clever, but not necessairly true) appeals to people who like their news jazzed up, that those folks who believe it like to ponder at length Paris' looong days in the pokey (or non-pokey in her case)? Could it be that people who watch KO have to have attention spans longer than the average mosquito on speed, because Keith does use polysyllabic words, and Keith also has commentators who lend credence to stories aired. (I'm typing this slowly to accomodate those who don't read well------- is it working?) later

I called attention to the "terror threats" and low numbers for Bush a couple of years ago. I sent this info on to a friend so he could check it out too. I'm hoping W goes away as soon as he can. I no longer trust anything the government tells us. Isn't that a wonderful legacy "it" is leaving us with.

Did the News Hole die?

Message (please, no HTML tags. Web addresses will be hyperlinked):