If Cheney is the master puppeteer, what is Rove?

Is Dick Cheney the Devil - One and the same?  Check the definitions:

Dick (noun)
Vulgar   A person, especially a man, regarded as mean or contemptible.

Devil (noun)
3. A wicked or malevolent person.
5. An energetic, mischievous, daring, or clever     person.

You decide!  I have!

PA - Rove runs he light show.

"Fair & Balanced" baseball?  On June 22nd I attended the A's vs Mets game at Shea Stadium.  The night had it all, including: a win by the Mets, a Met fan banner giveaway, beautiful baseball weather, Piazza returning in a pre-game left field stroll and interacting with the fans, Glavine going 8 innings and notching number 296, Beltran and Green parking two shots, Reyes running around causing havoc again, good fan interactions in the stands, and much more.  It also, however, was "FOX Fan Night".  This was a major intrusion on sacred ground.  First of all, I am not a "FOX Fan" nor a fan of FOX News.   The propaganda spread on this cable network is bad enough, but to have my Met Banner adorned with "FOX News" and  "Welcome to FOX Fan Night" is too much for me to bear.  I'm trying to figure out  how to  cover, black out,  cut out or otherwise make my banner "useful" as a  tool for "Rooting for the Mets" and  not as a  "Propaganda Tool".  I am very disappointed in the Mets management.  Bad enough that I have  had to look at the "FOX News" billboard all year at Shea (I go to about 20 games), but now I get this banner as I enter Gate C.  I beg you to try and help me convince the Mets that being a shill for Fox  is not appropriate and, having done so, perhaps the Mets need to provide equal time to "Air America".   Baseball is my escape from the endless everyday "spin" presented by the media.  The stadiums are sacred ground.  Since 1962 when I was 11 years old, I always looked at my Mets as the everyman team and not a team of elitists.  If I were inclined to look at them in a political light, I would think the Mets were the Democrats and the Yankees the Republicans.  Need proof?  Just look how Giuliani adores the Yanks and acts as if the Mets do not exist.  I hope Mayor Bloomberg will now be as independent with his baseball interests as he is now with his politics.  If looking at them in a "cable" light, I would think the Mets are "Countdown" and the Yankees are not.  Obviously, Fox wants to influence the viewing choices of Met fans and future cable news watchers.  It is a smart marketing ploy.  After all, they now have young fans holding up their banner in hopes that they will confuse "Noise" with "News" when they grow up.  My Mets have disappointed me greatly!  It is much more political than say ... the "Miss Rhiengold Contests" or "Banner Day Doubleheaders" of the early Mets years.    

To all you "informed" voters who voted this freak show into the White House, not once, but TWICE:  I told you so, and f*** you!

June 25, 2007, the Supreme Court rules against the "Bong Hits for Jesus banner," but in 2004, the Supreme Court ruled in favor of a student's t-shirt saying "Homosexuality is a sin, Islam is a lie, abortion is murder. Some issues are black and white!" ...And The Supreme Court today also backs the use of government funds to promote President Bush's Faith-Based and Community Initiatives by stating The Freedom from Religion Foundation had no right to sue...Let the return to the Dark Ages begin...what's next, we return to the earth is the center of the universe?

I would not normall bother to refute "Paul Gardner's"  ridiculous posts.  But I make an exception for anything that even hints at justifying another stupid, suicidal, pre-emptive war.

What a surprise.  The war in Iraq is such a success that the neo-cons can't wait to get started on Iran.  Paul Gardener's statistics exaggerate Bush's approval numbers (which are and have been under 30%) and try to pin Congress's numbers solely on the Democrats, when that party holds the Senate by virtue only of a so-called "Independent," Joe Lieberman.  The House has a larger Dem majority, but you need both chambers to pass legislation.  And then any Dem legislation has to run both the veto and "signing statement" gauntlet.  The country disapproves of BOTH parties in Congress because the Republicans have screwed everything up over the past 6 years and the Democrats haven't done anything yet to resolve Iraq.  But the new talking point is that the Dems are held in just as low esteem as Bush and his cronies.  No point in addressing that silliness, as the 2008 election (if it happens and it's not "Roved," will take care of that argument.

There is no credible evidence that Iran has a nuclear weapon.  There is no credible evidence that the Iranian-American living next door or in your classroom or running the local convenience store is a terrorist waiting to kill you.  That won't stop these power-mad authoritarian "leaders" or the sheeple who blindly follow them from making up whatever crapola they want and throwing onto this blog and others, just to get their poison into the system. Pretty soon it will be the "imminent threat" and the "Iranian mushroom cloud" and the link between Iran and 9/11.  

Sop let me say it here:  Iran has never attacked the United States.  Iran had nothing to do with 9/11.  No credible entity argues that Iran has a nuclear arsenal with which to attack the US or its neighbors.  The Iranian hostage situation, which is the most memorable anti-US action on the part of Iranians, was an outgrowth of the Iranian revolution against the Shah, who was seen as a puppet of the US.  That took place 28 years ago, and as Bill in Rochester noted above, many Iranians are as dissatisfied with their government as we are here.  Or at least the thinking 72 or 3% of us are.

As to the idea that the "media" is liberal:  The NY Times and Washington Post gave Bush/Cheney a free pass on the lies that drummed up support of the war.  The whole media establishment got "embedded" in the invasion and brought back breathless support for the war.  They stood still for the staged toppling of Saddam's stature, the "Mission Accomplished" moment, the weird "everything is peachy in New Orleans" staged event.  In this town, we can hear one local and one national "liberal" on a radio dial that has Hannity, Limbaugh, Glenn Beck, Michael Savage, Michael Reagan, Neal Boortz and Billo.  The 50,000 watts mega station has one "liberal" whose show runs opposite the Steelers on Sunday afternoon. The other "liberal" got shipped to the sister station which is now a "man show" format with no political talk.  We have two papers here, one more liberal but with op-ed balance and which is duly critical of the Democratic machine in the city.  The other "paper" is a right-wing extremist rag run by one of the guys who financed the witch hunt against Clinton.  So the idea that the "media" is overwhelmingly liberal is false. To say so is to either repeat some idiotic con talking point or to fail to use minimal powers of observation or to tell a big fat whopping lie.  

Who should be impeached first?  Gonzo first, because then Bush would have to nominate a new AG and the Dems could block another incompetent, unqualified lapdog from being appointed. The next step would be to hold Watergate-style hearings on Cheney and put that sucker under so much scrutiny he can't pull off the next pre-emptive war.

What scares me is that Bush, Cheney, and the pundits who support them (Bill Kristol, today, on Fox) don't care what happens to the country.  Endless debt, a dictatorship, thousands of military men and women killed or maimed, the destruction of the army--nothing stops their drive for power and money.

The office of the Vice President is not a part of the executive branch?  Since when did an executive order take precedence over the constitution?  It seems strange to me that an investigation into the security of classified documents was prevented from looking at the office of the Vice President since the Vice President's chief of staff was convicted of obstruction of justice in the investigation of the outing of a CIA covert operative.

It seems as though Dick and his cronies have found a way of not being caught in another cover up.

It reminds me of the kid that is teaching you a card game and forgets to tell you all the rules until it is to their advantage.

"Oh yeah, I forgot to tell you, I am not a part of the executive branch so none of this applies to me."

ALL HAIL THE FOURTH BRANCH OF THE U.S. GOVERNMENT!!!

****************THE DICK BRANCH********************

Sue. You're cool, too.  But then all Badgers are cool, icluding my cousins there, except for my cousin Jane, the Ogress of Misery.  Prairie du Chien is one of my ten favorite towns in the world.  Too bad they tore down the 'Spit and Whistle'.  I was given a shot of Creme de Menthe there, for an upset stomach from too much Tartar Sauce, and it made me projectile vomit a couple of partially digested Jade Green Walleye tails across the dance floor.  I was seven and the only one of the 100+ fishermen who didn't get a kick out of it.  I can still eat Walleye, the best tasting freshwater fish, but anything mint, immediately takes me back to the 'Spit and Whistle'.

'Lea Anne McBride, a Cheney spokeswoman, said Emanuel is the one who has to decide. "He can either deal with the serious issues facing our country or create more partisan politics," she said.'  Thank you Sean Duffy!  The stupidity of Ms. McBrides' comment, is unbelievable, as the DICK is probably one of the MOST SERIOUS issues our country is facing.  My God, the mess he has created is ill inducing!

And WOW, some of you are on a roll today.  I love it!

PEACE!

George, I'm glad I'm not the only one that sits here shaking their head and questioning the reasoning of the Supreme Court.  Yeah, you can throw Jesus into the mix anytime you want when it comes to free speech, like right wing decisions on what rights women have for their own bodies, but of course if it has to do with bongs-then freedom of speech no longer exists!

It is so incredibly sad that the Supreme Court judges will be here AFTER the DICK and his BUSH leave office-scary!  

HELP!

Linda - Thank you!! You summed it up perfectly, and I wish I had the skill to do it as well as you did!!

Ditto...Linda, Pittsburgh

Linda...the liberal media is a myth in radio talk shows...in a recent survey, "While progressive talk is making inroads on commercial stations, right-wing talk reigns supreme on America’s airwaves. Some key findings:

– In the spring of 2007, of the 257 news/talk stations owned by the top five commercial station owners, 91 percent of the total weekday talk radio programming was conservative, and only 9 percent was progressive.

Each weekday, 2,570 hours and 15 minutes of conservative talk are broadcast on these stations compared to 254 hours of progressive talk — 10 times as much conservative talk as progressive talk.

– 76 percent of the news/talk programming in the top 10 radio markets is conservative, while 24 percent is progressive."

I can get the link if anyone wants the link...Talk Radio is all conservative, all the time...

Ooookaaaay Steve T...Thanks for sharing.  I feel so much closer to you now. Please stay with politics and satire.  I enjoy reading those posts much more than your digestive history. <grin>

The notion that Cheney and Bush have kept America safe since 9/11 is patently absurd.  If the terrorists wanted them dead, they would be dead.  The truth of the matter is that there is no way bin Laden could have done the damage to America that Cheney and Bush have done.   They have done bin Laden's work for him.  

LA, Again I say thank you to Bill Clinton for American's not being afraid of the "DICK". We were told it was none of our business and what the DICK did in the oval office was for the betterment of the world. Therefore, why would people be afraid of the current DICK when actual DICK gave freedom to the American male, relieved us of our responsibilities , and made oral sex a priviledge.
 

The War on Poverty, the War on Drugs, The war on racism, The War On Terror.  Gee for a peace loving people we seem to get into a lot of "wars".  When do we get the "War on Americans"? Oh wait, we've already got that with Bush/Cheney.

Pam, Bill, Jamie, Terry, jp0433 and others-  as the two guys used to say in the Barttles and James wine-cooler ads:  "thank you for your support".  BTW- Paul- do keep in mind that Bush was warned about all the chaos (sp?) that would follow an invasion of Iraq, ESPECIALLY without any plans for what to do after the invasion.  What a guy, indeed!

Steve:  Thanks.  Yeah, I'm a Cheesehead.  Glad you can visit my state periodically - it's a piece of paradise.  But, ugh Walleye - I can't stand it - too "gamey" for me ("fishy" too).  Ditto venison (I won't eat Bambi either).   Creme de Menthe for an upset stomach?  I don't think so.  Next time try Pepto Bismol or an antacid.

On a different note:  Unfortunately it looks like we've picked up another flea for our flea circus.  Or is it just the same guy using different names?  Aren't you guys welcome on the Rove Kool Aid Drinkers blog?

Responding to these lame-o's and their talking points diatribes only encourages them.  It distracts from the discussions we are having and maybe that's what they're trying to do.

C A- you forgot to mention the recruiting value the enemy is enjoying by our being in their back yard, too!

Hey Steve- they got walleye over there in the Cedar?  And- amen to the 'the best tasting freshwater fish".

If what Chenney does is none of our business even if we pay for it, why was it the republicans business what Clinton did with Monica?
But actually I think there is a bigger problem: After what Chenney said all children’s are been taught the wrong facts in social studies.
But i get it this goverment and party does not have to fallow the rules of law, heck if they don't like part of the constitution they just change it. Well and we went to iraq why? wasn't it ( after all the lies about they where reponsible for 9/11) to get rit of a dictator? Don't we have two of them in power right now in WA?

Kay,
Bush was NEVER VOTED INTO THE WHITEHOUSE. The first time he was put into office by the Supreme Court, and the second time he was given the vote through Diebolds corrupt computers. Did you know that Diebold helped fund The Thug Bunches second run???????

Buzz.  Yup. And after floods we find a paddlefish or two.  But the best tasting Walleyes come from Lakes.  I didn't realize that until my Dad and I went to Canada and winched out some big ones.  Beer and Bisquick Batter'em and fry'em in Butter.  Oh, Baby!

Somebody tell me if Chenney is not part of the excecetive branch, who will step in if something happen to Bush? it couldn't be Chenney after all HE INSISIST HE IS NOT PART OF THE EXCECETIVE BRANCH. Would it be Rice? oh my god I hope not.

Buzz: You are correct regarding the recruting issues. Ben Laden and others like him are certainly not stupid. Call them mad, cruel, inhuman, terrorists, whatever you wish, but they are not dumb. Look what happened to the French in Vietnam and the US in Vietnam. Look what happened to the Russians in Afghanistan and now the US in Afghanistan and Iraq. Heck, look at the British during the American Revolution. Our people were called terrorists, but we called ourselves Freedom fighters. And there was no way that the British were going to succeed fighting that kind of conflict in a place so far away from their home bases. Don't believe a minute these folks don't also study history to determine what works and what does not work when it comes to bringing a major super-power to its knees. They know exactly what they are doing. Oh, from time to time they may send a cell or two to the US to initiate a terrorist act, but remember it took 4-5 years to plan the 911 attack. These are very very patient people. Will they hit the US again. Sure they will. But the fact is they like us right where they have us, in Afghanistan and Iraq and that was their intent. They will attempt to wear us down until we go home. In the interim they kill several thousand US soldiers in their back-yard where they can easily recruit and train additional terrorists. They also give the US a bloody nose in the eyes of the rest of the world where many now see us as the agressors and occupiers. It is an ideal situation for them even if they lose 40, 50, 100 people now and then. For every 1 terrorists killed in these places they are replaced by 5. It is a no win situation. Yes, 911 was measnt to shock the US and the world, but it was also intended to get the exact reaction out of this country (administration) that they got. They have to date achieved their objectives while we (the greatest and most powerful country in the world) look like a bunch of lost children in a forest that we should have never entered in the first place. I have suggested many times how you fight these people, but it seems those in power only have one agenda, nation build, attempt to control the oil, try and establish an American presence in the center of the troubled middle east, establish bases closer to Israel for their protection, etc. It will not work. We know it and the terrorists know it.    

George,  Thanks for that stats on the conservative domination of talk radio.  I copied your post and put it in a Word document to keep it at hand for the next time a someone tries to drag out that old lie.  If you've got a link, send it on and I will file that too.

While I agree with Independent that debating these fools is useless, since most of them prefer Animal House food-fights to reasoned debates, I have decided that we're just helping their spin machine by not calling out what they say as either incorrect or a deliberate lie and calling them out as either uninformed or deliberate liars. Maybe that will shame the mainstream media into a new reverence for the truth.  But I'm not holding my breath.  

Disgusted Texas, When everyone realizes that 9/11 was an inside job, it will be to late to stop what has occured the last 6 1/2 years!!!!!!!! With all that has happened I still wonder why people want to believe what the Bush aka Hitler propoganda machine keeps putting out there.. the thing is if they tell people the same thing over and over and brainwash them, they will believe it, why, because the people of this country are brainwashed through other means, unknowingly. Bin Laden is just used, I can bet all the crap people have been fed, may I add the same crap with him in the mountains and their training video. How funny it also is that when Bin Laden or his second in charge comes on, it is also when Bushs Thug Bunch are having problems.. It's their terror tactic to keep people believing there is a threat. I for one am not biting and I know there are many others who also don't! If you want to look at terrorism, just pay attention to those in the White House and their co-horts! Hopefully there are folks that read these blogs who will check into www.911mysteries.com, Loose Change, And Freedom To Fascism!

Oh, and as to the identity of our new flea, I was thinking "same guy, different name."  That could mean either some individual trying to look like a "movement" or just the same brain divided over different bodies.  Like in a horror movie where the alien virus invades the body but the brain is hooked up to the host or mothership (Rove, Limbaugh, Billo, you pick 'em).

For years now many of us knew who were the head hanchos, Bush is stupid Period, he has never had a company he didn't run into the ground! I can't believe this surprises people! Especially when it gets spit in their faces everytime Cheney talks on TV. He said that the Constitution is just a peice of paper! "HINT" "HINT"!!!!

Sue.  I was seven and those were different times. Hey, what did I know?  I was assured by the whole crowd, that Creme de Menthe was a tried and true 'Spit and Whistle Remedy' for tummy trouble.  And since that bunch had their share of what I'd call 'Robust Tummy's', and figuring they had their share of trouble with them, I said, "Here's How" and gulped it down.  The rest is 'Spit and Whistle History'.  Probably lost, until now.

Linda in Pittsburgh - Great town! Your "summary," as Bignardi puts it, took up half the blog. I will say that it was well written and well thought out. Obviously, I don't agree with more than 2 or 3 lines of it. Suffice to say that wars, big and little, will come and go. Every now and then Americans will die defending freedom. It started over 200 years ago and will continue forever. As long as there are major differences within the governments of this world, there is likely to be trouble at some point. Even families break up over religion, race, etc. The calvaries killed the indians. The indians killed the homesteaders. Cain killed his brother. All of this is nothing new. I don't condone killing but I understand it can happen to anyone for any stupid reason. Just read the newspaper.

Jamie in Chula Vista wants me to "answer" his/her questions. This isn't Meet The Press. You probably know what I'm goin to say anyway. I'm not trying to convert, preach, invert or teach you anything you will only "try" to tear apart, just for the sake of tearing it apart. There are 10 to 12 bloggers on this thread that say the same old thing. It's just a bunch of people who live to insult. They know who they are. When they wake up in the morning they hit the Newshole before they even go to the bathroom. Addiction to insult instead of reason.

Here's an example: Kay in Madison wants to F all voters who voted for this administration. Now there's a quality gal who obviously thought her comment through before she wrote it.

jp0433 (whatever the hell that is) Am I actually answering a robot? Thanks for emulating me over and over with the use of the word "MAN." Imitation is the best form of flattery. But be your own robot. Don't "TRY' to be cool. R2D2 says hello.

Terry in SC - you have a brain. Like you said, "who can really say?"

Buzzy (here we go again) - I got Bush's 33% approval rating from CNN (not Fox) a week ago. Take it up with them.

So here's the finale. Bush is president .. enforcer, whatever .. like him or not. Cheney is the VP, who at least has made a name for himself, like him or not. Remember when Gore was VP? No one knew it for 8 years. Bush & Cheney may or may not play by the rules but they see things ONE WAY, again, right or wrong, and they simply don't care if anyone likes it or not. They don't flip-flop. Clinton didn't play by the rules either. He had an easy ride and ALL of his problems were of his own doing. He did nothing about The Cole and the first World Trade Center bombing .. at least nothing substantial. Gore even distanced himself from Clinton. But that was then, this is now.

Not to worry, the Dems will possibly and probably win the next election, but with the newly elected Dems in congress doing absolutely nothing (approval rating 14%) .. who really knows?

CA.  When the British tried to enter the Himalayas, they were stopped cold by a small force of the Ghurka.  Finally, they stopped fighting and asked them if they'd like to join the British Army and guard that flank for Queen Victoria.  The Ghurka said "OK...but stay out.".  They have racked up more Victoria Crosses, for their small number, than any other regiment in the British Army.  Got to give the Brits some points for common sense on that one.

Hello Linda...the link is below...at least for radio talk, the liberal media is a myth...interesting article...rage on...


http://thinkprogress.org/2007/06/20/radio-report/

Brenda...I was about five blocks away from the Pentagon on 9-11 in a training class for work...when I heard a plane had hit the Pentagon, I ran down, wanted to help out...I got there about five minutes after the explosion...I saw no tail or wings...no fuselage...no seats...nothing that resembled a 757 hitting the Pentagon...when I saw the hole in the Pentagon, I thought where did plane's wings go? I know what I saw and at 9:59 I was forced to leave the area when three soldiers with rifles forcefully told me to leave...I am still curious what really happened to the Pentagon...Also, Google Steven E. Jones from BYU and read his work on why and how the Towers collapsed...fascinating stuff....

OMG Steve.  Alcohol to a 7 year old?  Where did those bar flies get their medical knowledge - the looney bin?  

Too bad you didn't puke in their faces.

Creme de Menthe is great stuff - particularly blended with ice cream (grasshopper is what it's called, I think).

OK, Steve- one more fishing comment, then I better let the space go back to the real bloggers here.  Try drifiting below the dam at Saylorville over in DSM.  Motor up to the dam as close as is safe, then drift a nightcrawler/spinner combo downstream with the current.  Good walleyes to be had.  OK- so as to not be totally off-topic on these pages, I offer this- it somehow reminds me of the current administration:  "are all liars fishermen, or are all fishermen liars?"

George, Hammonton, NJ (Sent Monday, June 25, 2007 9:41 PM)  It is probably true that conservatives dominate radio, the reason is that progressive ideas don’t sell.  The market – people – decides this market and most don’t want to turn on a radio and listen to progressives tell people how horrible Americans are.  People prefer to hear that they are special or part of something special – and quite correctly conservative radio tends to portray America as good.   The progressives on radio were/are unentertaining, negative, and boring.

Well, Paul, I do have to agree with you that "there are 10- to 12 bloggers on this thread that say the samo old thing".  Let's see, there's you, Jerry from CC TX, and, uh, who'r some of the others?  BTW- a week ago was a week ago.  I don't think I'll take up anything with a news source that can't stop a listener from using outdated quotes from their broadcasts.

"Brenda...I was about five blocks away from the Pentagon on 9-11 in a training class for work...when I heard a plane had hit the Pentagon, I ran down, wanted to help out...I got there about five minutes after the explosion...I saw no tail or wings...no fuselage...no seats...nothing that resembled a 757 hitting the Pentagon...when I saw the hole in the Pentagon, I thought where did plane's wings go? I know what I saw and at 9:59 I was forced to leave the area when three soldiers with rifles forcefully told me to leave...I am still curious what really happened to the Pentagon...Also, Google Steven E. Jones from BYU and read his work on why and how the Towers collapsed...fascinating stuff....
George, Hammonton, NJ
"
I've seen a six seater twin engine aircraft balled up in a bail of un identifiable crap midway of a runway. The entire plane including what was left of the passengers would fit in the bed of a small pickup truck.
If you want to see the remains of the jet that hit the pentagon the images can be found on the net, everything from beer can sized fragments on the outside of the building to the complete cargo compartment with luggage wadded up like it had gone through a hay bailer and compressed into a massive lump deep inside the building.

As for why the Trade Center buildings collapsed, structural steel loses 60% of its strength at the temperature of burning jet fuel.
A recent overpass collapse after a fuel tanker explosion demonstrated this very nicely.

Paul Gardner, Cincinnati, Ohio - I commend you, and I am sincere about that.  Thank you for responding in the way you did; and I did not offense by your using my name, as you are entitled to your opinion as am I. I am keeping this short, to not take up so many column inches.  Thank you for that insight also, as I am being sincere.

I do believe though, while this is not “Meet the Press”, by providing answers to those you ask you a question, it could help our dialogue, as I know it would mine.  Just a suggestion.

Thank you again, and while I agree with your comments regarding insults, as I certainly have been guilty and I apologize, you, sir, have been guilty also. Again,   I apologize for insulting you, as I know it gets me nowhere, and I am sorry.

Thanks again!!

PEACE!!

Heres a link to the Gallup Poll.
http://www.galluppoll.com/content/default.aspx?ci=1723
Check out Truman's approval ratings while you are at it.

Pam - Meet the Press - another show I won't watch because of all the kissy-kissy with the NeoConJobs.  Why don't they just move that show and Chris Matthews to Faux News where they can continue to pretend to be "fair and balanced."  At least we know up front that Joe Scarborough is a Republican and acts like one too.

Buzz - Thank you!!

Sue - Agreed!! "Meet the Press to Faux News too!! Thanks for that brilliant suggestion!! I sure hope Chris Mathews reads these blogs, in particular, the one titled "Help Hardball"!! Questions to that sub-human creature Ann Coulter, HAH!!

That was it for me!! No more second changes for Chris, on ANY program he even gets close enough to smell!!

Scott...we basically agree...although it is not as simple as the power of the marketplace...if you read the article, successful "liberal" shows were pulled off the air for different reasons...simply maybe hate of liberals sells better than the flaws with America...I'm just tired of hearing about the liberal media bais...

Sue/Pam - showing my age here but I remember when Meet the Press was an excellent show. That, of course, was before news became infotainment.

Shocking, shocking but I agree with scott henderson nv (Sent Tuesday, June 26, 2007 2:10 PM).  In this, the Paris generation, who wants to hear calm reasonable discussions about problems and those who both cause and can resolve them? Why don't those pesky "liberals" leave us alone in our almost drugged-like state of denial? (I don't want to take out the garbage, Mom. I don't want to clean up my room, Dad. I don't want to do my homework. I don't want to think. I don't want to be involved. I want to BUY. I want to PARTY. I want to relax in my easy chair and not have to work to ensure that my god damn country isn't being taken over by fascists!!)

Wayne...So tell me where the wings went? If they snapped off, why didn't I see them? I was there right after the explosion. If the wings struck the building, where are the indentions? Why is the whole so round? I saw no chuck of fuselage with luggage wadded up either. I was there for ten minutes...O will never forget what I saw...I have seen many of the models of the crash. I have seen many of the images that are all over the Internets, none satisfy me Wayne...and the government controls the release of the images that were taken that day at the Pentagon...Do you really trust anything this government has done in relationship to
9-11? I don't...And a plane hitting a runway is far different than a plane hitting a building...Plus, a 757 is a lot different than a six seat Cessna...weak analogy Wayne...I am not some wild conspiracy theorist, I just know what I saw, and I haven't read an answer that satisfies me...no pictures capture what I saw either...Wayne, read Steven E. Jones work about the Towers...Plus, an overpass and the World Trade Center Towers are not the same Wayne...

Buzz.  Hey, this fishing stuff kinds goes with the Cheney 'Angler' thing, except of course, we're angling for fish, whereas he's fishin' for angles.  I used to jig for Walleyes on the Mississippi, bouncing off the bottom, most any bait. My biggest fish was a nine pound female (my Dad was pretty envious that day). In Canada, throw it down pretty deep and they'll hit it, minnows worked best but they'd hit a Dare-devil, too.  I'll try Saylorville next time I'm in 'the Monks'.  Sue.  Like I said, back then were different times.  I had two friends who were confirmed alchoholics by seven.  One of them was told by his father that, since his sister had also started drinking, one of them had to quit 'cause he could only afford two alchoholics in the family.

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