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The Plot Thickens

Posted: Monday, January 28, 2008 1:22 PM by Countdown

Several huge storylines we're following today.  The Kennedy clan backs Barack Obama in a rally in Washington...the race in Florida tightens for the Republicans...and all of a sudden Florida is an issue with the Democrats.  Senator Clinton, apparently ignoring the agreement to ignore Florida, is preparing to declare victory there tomorrrow night.  Could another controversial election in Florida be deciding who will be the next president?

And oh yeah, President Bush delivers his final State of the Union Address tonight.  We'll have the latest on all of this, including our own State of the Union that may differ slightly from Mr. Bush's.  Big show...hope you can join us.

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So, I guess there won't be time for COUNTDOWN's hilarious "Florida tribute"? Oh well, I guess I can forgive you. Listen to Brian Unger's take on tonight's "State of the Union," and that'll give you some much-needed laughs in prep for what Keith has to say this evening.

I suppose it would be pointless to hope against hope that we could say "bu-bye" to "Mayor Rudy" if he bites the big one in Florida tomorrow. But, a girl can dream, can't she?
Senator Clinton, didn't you promise, with every one else, to not campaign in Michigan and Florida?  Doesn't your word mean anything to you?  Should it mean anything to us?  
Senator Obama, I'm so pleased you didn't listen to the press and instead went right after the Clintons.

Bill Clinton should never assume again that anything he has to say will go unchallenged. Never.
I don't know if Barack Obama is going to be the democratic nominee. However, I am glad democrats are standing up to Bill Clinton and the message is resonating with him. He's gotten his own way for far too long. The Jesse Jackson comment was disgusting.
Pat, Boston, MA (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 1:27 PM)

My dear friend Pat --I could not agree with you more; however, I always agree with you 99.9999% of the time - LOL!!

After Saturday night, I can no longer support Senator Clinton -- unless she ultimately is the Democratic Party nominee.  The comments made by former President Bill Clinton –who, make no mistake, I still and always will love were not only out of line, and they were disrespectful and disgraceful!! If I didn't know who I was listening to, I would have thought it was a GOP candidate.

Both morally and ethically, I cannot support Senator Clinton; I have not "warmed" to Senator Obama as so many, many have; however, I respect him immensely and will do everything I can to “try” to warm to him!!

PEACE MY DEAR FRIEND --FOR YOU ARE MY INSPIRATION!!
Bill Clinton should never assume again that anything he has to say will go unchallenged. Never. Pat, Boston, MA (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 1:52 PM)

Hey Pat – You’re talking about Bill Clinton.  Never say never and you’ll never be wrong.  Or you’ll always be right.  Or something like that.  

go, Pats, go.
Carol, Long Valley NJ (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 1:51 PM)

Agreed; attempting to get the delegates certified was the first act of arrogance --to be fair --Obama ran ads in Florida last week --however, Senator Clinton is, by far, attempting to slap the DNC in the face!! It's shameful --the people of Florida and Michigan should be petitioning --ON THEIR OWN --if they feel so strongly --NOT Senator Clinton!!

PEACE
I suppose it would be pointless to hope against hope that we could say "bu-bye" to "Mayor Rudy" if he bites the big one in Florida tomorrow. But, a girl can dream, can't she? Krista Swisher, Indianapolis, IN (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 1:46 PM)

Oh, Krista – yes she can.  But it does leave Rudy Slippers with the problem of what to do with the stunning pink evening gown and matching patent leather heels he bought for the premature coronation ball.  It’s becoming patently obvious he will not be invited.  His coach will turn back into a pumpkin at precisely midnight on Wednesday morning.  Blow him a kiss goodbye, everybody.
Ted Kennedy and Barack Obama at same Univesity as the one JFK was at when he made what many believe was JFK's greatest speech as President of the United States:

Jerome Wiesner on JFK's speech in June 1963 --
"The speech at American University made a profound impression on the Soviet Union. Intelligence reports indicated that Chairman Khrushchev had said it was the best speech ever made by an American President. We were hopeful that this would finally mean real progress on a nuclear test ban treaty. Ever since the development of nuclear bombs, we had been attempting to bring them under control."

Dean Rusk said:
"It was a remarkable speech, and it had a remarkable effect on world opinion. The President wanted to indicate that we looked toward the future with hope. He wanted us to believe in the possibility of peace. "The speech was remarkable, I feel, because it had so much of President Kennedy personally in it. Because it reflected his magnanimity, his urbanity and the sense of the civilized man that marked so much of his mood and his action, and his style. And because it reflected his total commitment to peace."
Just like a clinton to declare victory while running against no one.  This nonsense about agreeing to things like Michigan and Florida as well as the casino caucauses until the race is tight is how spoiled toddlers act.  The more of this crap the clintons pull the more I want her to lose.  It is exactly the kind of politics we need to move past.  
Pam Bignardi, San Pedro, California (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 2:06 PM)

Please be fair, Obama's ads were national and it would have been almost impossible to decouple Florida from the national buy.
Anna Molly (: (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 2:10 PM) I'm sure "America's Mayor" will still be BFF with Roger Ailes; there will surely be some future party or gala at FAUX News where the gown and shoes will come in handy as long as he doesn't use the reflective quality of said shoes to go looking up ladies' dresses.
I too was thrilled to see Obama go after Bill especially after that reprehensible Jesse Jackson comment.  Bill participated in what was nothing more than race baiting and attempted voter disenfranchisement.  He, after being called "the first black president", attempted to dimish the accomplishments of a black man because it was politically expediant for his wife.  Those are the political tactics the country is tired of.  This isn't the 90's and if Bill can't move forward they should both be left behind.  
I guess we are not suppose to make to much of any one endorsement but a man who can inspire Kennedys is a man who should be president.  The only endorsement that would mean more to me is Al Gores.
Pat, Boston, MA (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 2:14 PM)

Thank you Pat; tears again!!

PEACE MY DEAR FRIEND!!
Well we lost 5 more American Troops today. How stimulating Dubya.I sure their families are stimulated.Well we've all forgot about the war with all this election and primary stuff and you and Cheney's run up and lies that got us in this War.
Let us see the war cost will be on one trillion very soon. Still no goal line and ever changing mission more of our kin killed for his lies.
But the stimulation the granddaddy for economics,and vote buy offs,with our money and Pelosi and Reid nodding their heads up and down like the usual cave ins on the war and everything else.They are the best Republican Leaders in both houses.
Now this is like playing finance with a loan shark.They are going to take our tax dollars,say they are giving them back to us after we have already been taxed on them and these dollars really don't exist as they are defict dollars or more raiding of the Social Security pot to help finance they are notorious for,cousre most folks don't understand how all that has been going on,they are too busy with two people at that $8.00 an hour job to feed their family to keep up with that. Looks like the Seniors on Social Security wont be getting a cut,course they paid taxes all their lives.
And the American Public because they are out of money,the poor guy is supposed to feel good about this.
Well feel good about this Mr. Stimulation we need somebody that isn't running all over the country campaigning to propose a real stimulus.Cap gasoline at $1.75 a gallon Congress that's stimulation for everyone.Tax oil imports at 15% or 20 % per barrel before it gets to the pump from Dubyas Saudi Pals to pay for social programs,jobs,health and education.
Show some GUTS Congress the folks your sending to die are.Yes Five More Families will hear the worst news of their lives and DOD is asking for 70 billion so you can kill some more on borrowed money from us.
Oh but we will be stimulated in a few months!
Well we lost 5 more American Troops today. How stimulating Dubya.I sure their families are stimulated.Well we've all forgot about the war with all this election and primary stuff and you and Cheney's run up and lies that got us in this War.
Let us see the war cost will be on one trillion very soon. Still no goal line and ever changing mission more of our kin killed for his lies.
But the stimulation the granddaddy for economics,and vote buy offs,with our money and Pelosi and Reid nodding their heads up and down like the usual cave ins on the war and everything else.They are the best Republican Leaders in both houses.
Now this is like playing finance with a loan shark.They are going to take our tax dollars,say they are giving them back to us after we have already been taxed on them and these dollars really don't exist as they are defict dollars or more raiding of the Social Security pot to help finance they are notorious for,cousre most folks don't understand how all that has been going on,they are too busy with two people at that $8.00 an hour job to feed their family to keep up with that. Looks like the Seniors on Social Security wont be getting a cut,course they paid taxes all their lives.
And the American Public because they are out of money,the poor guy is supposed to feel good about this.
Well feel good about this Mr. Stimulation we need somebody that isn't running all over the country campaigning to propose a real stimulus.Cap gasoline at $1.75 a gallon Congress that's stimulation for everyone.Tax oil imports at 15% or 20 % per barrel before it gets to the pump from Dubyas Saudi Pals to pay for social programs,jobs,health and education.
Show some GUTS Congress the folks your sending to die are.Yes Five More Families will hear the worst news of their lives and DOD is asking for 70 billion so you can kill some more on borrowed money from us.
Oh but we will be stimulated in a few months!
More superdelegates for Obama! Does anyone feel the way I do? That it's pointless to vote if the superdelegates disenfranchise you? Because that's what will happen this November: superdelegates McCaskill, Kennedy, et. al. will vote for Obama at the convention even if Hillary wins big in more primaries.  
"Both morally and ethically, I cannot support Senator Clinton; I have not "warmed" to Senator Obama.( Pam Bignardi, Jan. 28, 1:58PM)

So here's the $64,000 question, Pam. Would you, at this stage in time, be open to voting Republican if
John McCain, who has voted many times against President Bush and is considered to appeal to many Democrats and Independents, gets the nomination?

It's really not a trick or loaded question. Many Republicans find fault with McCain. There is still a long way to go in this election and while every viable candidate is starting to collect endorsements from VIP's of all kinds, the issues will soon be taking a more important role in this race so it may be hard for some to commit at this time.

Any thoughts on how you see the future of America, leadership-wise?



Full Moon (if the moderator will allow)
There are two unions , Keith's and the liberals, and then the real Union.
We are strong,our economy is strong,our military is strong,and people are enthused.
In Keith's world,people are in dispair because the gov't is not giving them enough,the people who own businesses and are taking the risks are not simply giving away their hard earned money. People who work hard and made money just feel they can spend their money better than the gov't can. You see, the gov't has NO MONEY. The money they get comes from US, me and some of you.
In the world of liberals everyone is doomed.Cannot or will not put forth the effort to succeed. In my Union,everyone has equal chances. Yes, we are the richest and most charitable country on the face of the earth. (Don't count Al Gore who only gave $350 to charity on his last tax return)
The stock market is over 12000, where was it during Clinton? Enough said.
God bless our Union,for it's state is extremely happy.  
Pam.......I don't need your prayers.  I am doing just fine without them.  You, like most Democrats are by nature un-happy people who blame others for their problems.  I suppose you are gonna blame Bush for the fire in Las Vegas on Friday.  Might as well.....you liberals blame him for all your problems anyway.
Laura......what has the President done to me?  My life is pretty dam good actually.  Good job, decent pay, roof over my head.  I have actually made more money during this Presidency than ever before.  I credit myself for that because of MY hard work.  Its my responsibility to be successfull.  No one elses!
Mark Curtis: Not the President, not the gov't....MINE!!  So all you liberals quit you crying!!  Life isn't that difficult.  people make it difficult, then blame someone else.  that's the liberal way
Please be fair, Obama's ads were national and it would have been almost impossible to decouple Florida from the national buy.
Carol, Long Valley NJ (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 2:19 PM)

Thank you Carol; I was unaware of this!! A stupid question though why would it have been impossible to have them blocked in Florida --seriously, I really don't understand the ins and outs of how this type of advertising works --but I am sure that Obama was above board!!

PEACE!!

Mark, AZ (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 3:07 PM)

But Mark I didn't "pray for YOUR soul" --I posted that message to scott –hmmm - thanks for further proving what I have long believed though --

PEACE!!
Full Moon (if the moderator will allow)
Full Moon (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 3:02 PM)

I'm sorry Full Moon, but not a chance!! First of all, McCain has sold out to all his beliefs to win the presidency --more importantly, he has every intention of continuing in Iraq where Bush will have left off.

I have not one value in common with any republican I know, except for my belief in God.  My ideals are the polar opposite of everything the GOP stands for.  The contempt for the poor, the middle class, social programs and individual choices to name a few; the GOP could care less, in my opinion, that vets are homeless; millions do not have healthcare; tax breaks should go to the wealthiest of wealthiest in this country, etc..

No; I have never voted for a republican for these reasons and many more; I will vote for Senator Obama if he is my Party's nominee --I have always maintained that --however, I no longer support Senator Clinton --I also hope she does not win the Primary in my state of California --although she is ahead in the polls by double digits with a week to go --MANY things can change!! Hopefully they will!!

Sorry Full Moon; however, thank you for your post --I enjoyed it friend!!

PEACE!!
If 70% of the country is against the war and occupation of Iraq, then why would Romney, McCain and Huckabee all state that they will stay in Iraq, if elected? Trying to solidfy that hard core right wing minority base? Very noble of them, willing to spend the blood of others. Why? Vanity? Ego?
 Our economy is a mess, and it is going to take spending cuts across the board, and no tax breaks for the rich, everyone has to share the pain.
  The war is costing a fortune, crippling this country for years to come, I don't see how any right thinking person can believe we have to stay in Iraq. I don't give a damn about the surge, if the Iraqi government can't find common ground amongst themselves, the "success" of the surge is irrelevant. Please don't write back how the violence is down, it's down because we're paying off the Sunnis and the Shiites to help kill off the remaining Al-Quida forces. IF you don't think they're reconstituting themselves in Afhganistan, you're wrong.
 I have little respect for the Democrats, none for the Republicans, but folks, if you want someone to at least make an attempt to bring our troops home, you can't vote for a Republican. Romney, McCain and Huckabee drew the line in the sand, Mission: To BE CONTINUED...
After Saturday night, I can no longer support Senator Clinton -- unless she ultimately is the Democratic Party nominee.  

Pam Bignardi, San Pedro, California (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 1:58 PM)

That last part of the sentence is troubling.  You rail against Clinton, and are no longer supporting her.  It should be the end of the sentence.  While I understand that you are loyal to democratic party, you cannot agree with how the Clinton's have acted. The way the Clinton's have run this campaign is downright reprehensible.  She will do and say anything to get elected, and she now has an extremely formidable opponent in Barack Obama.  So this discussion may be mute, because if things continue to unravel, she will not be the nominee.  You may want to consider voting independent.

It is becoming more evident to me that the Rovian smear tactics against Hillary and the crowning of Obama by the corporate media are working well when even Olbermann joins in.  Hillary DID NOT campaign in Florida.  She DID follow the rules of the DNC.  The Hillary bashing is getting disgusting and WILL backfire.  She will be looked upon as a victim, the same way that Obama was in South Carolina.  The only difference is that he was no victim and used the media as a tool to perpetuate the racism issue.  Since when is a white person a racist if they simply question or criticize a black person?  Obama is starting to sound like OJ.  Does anyone remember that spectacle?
I for one am proud to support Hillary.  And I have no qualms about saying that I want a woman as my next president.  The men have made a shambles of this country.  Let's have a real change, not the same old testosterone driven nonsense of the past 250 years.
I wish Ted would have endorsed Obama before SC,probably would have mada a difference. We don't take to kindly to the far left. Obama now needs to be upfront on his intentions,because Ted Kennedy is the most partisan there is and is in no way looking to bring repubs and Dems together. Ther3efore we must conclude that Obama is a liar.  
Do any of you brilliant people happen to know already who will be giving the Democratic response to tonight's speech? I tried "the Google" and got nowhere. I'm sure it'll be on COUNTDOWN tonight, but I was just curious.
Pam Bignardi, San Pedro, California (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 3:16 PM)

There are at least two categories of commericials on your local TV stations, the national ones, like for car brands, beer, soda and snacks, and the local ones, i.e. Joe's diner, or Sam's used car lot -- these usually have local phone numbers.  

The national ones are embedded within the program and are part of the satellite feed from the networks to the local stations.  The local ones are added by the station.  

It was very obvious which ones were which back when we had a C-Band satellite dish.  There were no local commericals, boy do I miss that feature.
Pam.......You've known all along I am right?  Its about time!
Wonderful Newsholers, I just found the answer to my previous question. KS Gov. Kathleen Sebelius will be giving the Democratic response to the State of the Union address tonight. Isn't she the one who, after the tornadoes in Greenville, said that recovery would be hampered by the fact that a lot of the National Guard forces and equipment in Kansas were in Iraq?
Would you guys consider actually covering some real news?  All of this campaign coverage is insulting.  How about we get some news on the Iraq war and the economy?  This is getting pathetic.
HMMM curiouser and curiouser. The Kennedys are endorsing Obama this time around. Bill Clinton seems to have really stepped in it in South Carolina.
Do not forget people that South Carolina is the most ehnically diverse state to vote yet and look at the results Obama outpolled Clinton and Edwards COMBINED.
This is VERY BAD NEWS for supporters of HRC. I think that as they grow more desperate the Clinton attacks on Obama will become more and more strident with the stridency being inversely proportional to the facts.
I intend to vote for John Edwards on Tsunami Tuesday.
The irony of that is not lost on me either. A far-left Democrat like me voting for THE SOUTHERN WHITE GUY because I think he's the most progressive  
Updates on FISA would be appreciated.
Hey Pam,
 Since Mark doesn't need your prayers, can I have the good intentions? I can use all the good thoughts I can get.
BA (2:52 PM Post):

I hear you BA. Parents are answering their doors and being told by US Military represantatives that their son/daughter just lost their lives in Iraq while in the background on their television sets the news of the day is the bickering between one set of Presidential candidates who promise to remove the troops from Iraq or the continued falsehoods being stated by another set of Presdential canddiates that the surge is working. I just wonder after the Officer has left and the parents close their door in shock if they really care what is being reported on the news. Do you think they might stop in front of the TV before switching it off, stare as if in a trance at the pundits describing the political races and say what? What?

How ironic and sad that any mention made of Iraq during the political debates seems to be made almost as an after thought. While a few battle for the political careers there are still hundreds of young Americans still fighting for their lives. Where has the passion gone to end this senseless conflict and to save the lives of our kids who are still fighting in Iraq.

To those who have disagreed with previous comments that Iraq is just another Vietnam. Well here is your proof. And what do they share that make both conflicts so alike. It is called American complacency. It is called a lack of urgency. And it is called a shift in the public's interest. It has been reported that the top issue with voters in these primaries has become the economy. They say it is the economy stupid. Sorry, I must respectfully disagree, it's the lives of our young people in Iraq stupid.                
Obama does have one thorny problem: He HAS to get down in the mud to counter the Clinton slime fest. Yet he  HAS to try and run a positive upbeat hopeful campaign. That is one very tough nut to crack.
Anyone who can do that is already a long way down the road to the White House.
I can't believe any candidate even a democrat would accept an endorsement from Teddy Kennedy.

On a different note, is the democrat party disenfranchising their voters because the States are not following some arbitrary rules?   I guess the dem elites don’t want to leave it to their voters to choose the delegates.  
{Note to Pam}:

I have JFK on my mind today big time and this story keeps coming back to me - accompanied by a smile -

One of my sisters, knowing of the hundreds of books I had collected over the years about JFK, as well as my having worked at the library as a volunteer, bought me as a joke the most beautiful red suit which reminded my sister of something Jackie Kennedy may have worn in the 1960's. A few years later, I decided to wear the suit to a semi-formal family reunion at the JFK Library. Well unbeknownst to me, the library was showing off Jackie's clothes and sure enough, right there for everyone to see in this huge glass case, was the red suit Jackie wore when she did her televised tour of the White House. It looked exactly like the suit I had on. Exactly. Color and everything. Good grief. Talk about wanting to crawl into a hole at the time!

Needless to say, my mother and sisters laughed about it for a long, long time.

(My point-I have to get you to that library one of these days. It's beautiful there.)
Cindy, Columbia SC (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 3:36 PM)

And you reach that conclusion how?  Certainly not with ONE thing you stated!! First of all, I am as far the the left as one can get --I am a PROUD liberal --therefore, your comments against Senator Kennedy mean ZERO to me!!

Next, how does his endorsement of Senator Obama prove him a liar?  No case made at all!

Good day!!
(My point-I have to get you to that library one of these days. It's beautiful there.)
Pat, Boston, MA (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 4:06 PM)

Thank you for sharing that story --I WOULD have crawled under a rock --well, maybe not, it a reunion at the JFK library!!

Also, I can't think of another person I would be honored to go to the JFK library with; you are first on my list friend!!

PEACE MY DEAR FRIEND!!
Hey Pam,
Since Mark doesn't need your prayers, can I have the good intentions? I can use all the good thoughts I can get.
Frederick Sweeney, Brooklyn (Sent Monday, January 28, 2008 4:01 PM)

Dear Frederick; I am honored you would want my prayers; yes, you have them sir!!

PEACE & GOD BLESS!!
Cindy, Columbia (3:36 PM Post):

So by achieving the endorsement of Ted Kennedy Obama is no longer a person who is looking to unite rather then divide. I don't see the connection Cindy. You may think that Ted Kennedy is very partisan but how do you then project the same on to Obama? How can this guy win? He is thrashed by people on the left  for stating that Reagan transformed the political agenda and now thrashed by you for gaining Kennedy's endorsement. Perhaps Obama's best bet is to just keep his mouth shut for the rest of the primary. God forbid if anyone in the center endorsed Obama. He would then be thrashed by those from both the left and the right for being a traitor to their particular causes.  
It is becoming clear that msnbc has endorsed the Obama candidacy. The comments about the Obama victory in SC were made with absolutely no sense of historical reference. The fuss being made over exit polling was uncalled for in light of the fact that SC does not represent the rest of the country. These small caucuses and primaries pale in comparison to what will happen on Feb 5. It was not shocking that Obama won SC. Mrs. Clinton remains the most qualified candidate-whether you like her or not.
Chris Matthews and Tim Russert are unable to remain unbiased. Keith, have you joined them? Your coverage of the Clinton-Obama race has been fairly straight until Saturday. Maybe everyone needs to take a step back and think about how you might be influencing the election and whether it is healthy for news broadcasters to pick the Democratic nominee.
More Iraq coverage would be good but I wonder if there are any journalists left there.  More journalists have been killed in Iraq than in the entire vietnam war and to get anywhere they have to travel with US troops.  Which is limiting to say the least.  I find it very telling about the reality in Iraq that were ever else in the world there is conflict reporters can travel there and report from the streets.  
Subject: Worst Person in the World

Rush Limbaugh today lied on the air to a woman from Texas about Solar Electric generation (PV). He lied to the woman when he said he owned solar panels when he lived in Sacramento. Stating that they made no difference in his power bill, ("No excess power was ever generated"). And he added, "it is a fallacy that your power meter will roll backwards if you do generate any excess power". He said [to her] that installing solar panels, on your house does nothing to save energy.

Rush also said "what about cloudy on days" ["solar panels don’t generate any power"]. These are totally lies, not true, totally misleading statements. Perhaps he is just not informed or he is JUST PLAN LYING.

I think he is just lying.

I can’t take listing to Rush for very long and I only listened to the last 40 minutes of today’s show.

See this reference information from SACRAMENTO MUNICIPAL UTILITY DISTRICT at this link:

http://www.smud.org/community-environment/pdfs/2853%20Solar%20FAQs%20Revised%202.pdf

Although I am a democrat, if Senator Clinton wins the nomination I will consider voting for Senator Mccain. As an African American I am really disgusted with the low ball tactics of the Clintons and their win at all cost attitude. In order to repair this party that she is divding daily, she will be compelled to put Barack Obama on the ticket. Unfortunately the was she is going, that might not help her chances either.
I'll come back around when all of this primary insanity is over . . . SO ridiculous and the media needs to just shut the heck up . . . they are the cause of the overwhelming majority of all of the "controversy."  None of the media chosen and driven candidates should be the choices we have . . . we don't need superstars, we need substance.

Later.
Well, it was about time that someone took the mantle of elder stateman, evidently Bill hasn't learned how to act as such, so to coin morning Joe --
"Big Dawg was like a runaway beertruck in the mountains -- Hillary may be very competent and smart, but to go through these drama every couple of weeks is not what I want to do again, and again, and again and again, and again -- She is the PAST -- Obama is the FUTURE  let's move to the future -- YES, WE CAN!!


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