The SCHIP Veto

Laura in Los Angeles — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 18:36:03 GMT

What is the thinking behind Dubya's vetoing something so needed by children? He thinks nothing of billions for a futile war, but to help kids stay healthy, a no go. Amazing.

The SCHIP Veto

Carol, Long Valley NJ — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 18:41:56 GMT

Senator Frank R. Lautenberg (D-NJ) has a petition to try to override the "heartless one's" veto of the SCHIP bill.

http://www.democratsenators.org/o/19/t/70/petition.jsp?petition_KEY=77

Message from the Senator

Please sign my petition calling on my colleagues in Congress to join me in voting to override President Bush’s cruel decision to undermine the health of our nation’s children. I will use your support to help convince other members of Congress to do the right thing.

Sincerely,
Frank R. Lautenberg

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D. Buccini, Virginia Beach, VA — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 18:43:16 GMT

There's no figuring out why "W" vetoed the childrens' insurance bill - he needs the money for Iraq. Why help the kids when he can send them to Iraq when they get older and just have them killed off!! This guy has got to GO!!!!!!!!!

The SCHIP Veto

John, Phila — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 18:48:47 GMT

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Scott Copeland, Naples, Fl — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 18:54:50 GMT

Let's hope the Democrats in the House & the Senate grow a spine about this one, it's about time somebody told Bush and the loyal bushies it's over.

The SCHIP Veto

Krista Swisher, Indianapolis, IN — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:17:41 GMT

Could the "Mukasey confirmation front" news have something to do with this little tidbit I found this morning?! Cue up the bad 70s music before reading this link!

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/10/03/attorney.general.ap/index.html

Also, concerning the SCHIP veto, I posted some thoughts in the previous thread, so I won't repeat them here. But, I need some help from you brilliant people! I know how to access the website for the House of Representatives but couldn't figure out for the life of me how to get to the voting record for the version of SCHIP legislation that GWB vetoed this morning. I want to see who voted against it; there is enough in the Senate to override the veto but not in the House. Maybe...just maybe...I know I'm getting my hopes up, but what the heck...some good 'ol fashioned public shame toward those who voted against it MIGHT be enough to get enough of them (I think a couple dozen at this point) to change their minds? At least ask them to go back to their constituents with a straight face and explain why they voted against it? So, if anyone could give me some guidance on how to access the voting record for this legislation, I'd appreciate it awfully very much!

GO CUBS!

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Sue, West Allis, Wisconsin — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:29:36 GMT

I don't like how they're funding SCHIP. It's a national priority and should be funded out of the budget.

Sheesh - we can pay a trillion dollars for a war and not get health care to our kids? What kind of heartless soul-less idiots do we have in Washington?

Shame.

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Scratching my head — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:32:41 GMT

Since Lim-com-poop mentioned the subject of Bush-SCHIP-children this morning on our local radio station I would guess Bush is trying to stop any and all children from getting the health insurance they need. But explain to me again how this helps poor children? I mean really you stop the whole thing with a pen stroke and this is good? The man needs a good head doctor.

The SCHIP Veto

Paulet, Simsbury, CT — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:37:10 GMT

This is a Sin. All they need to do is take away 6 Blackwater contractors and it's paid for -- perhaps we don't need as many visiting "senators and congressmen shopping in the market square in Iraq" this would certain pay for the children to get their insurance.

The SCHIP Veto

C A, Tuscaloosa, AL — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:37:25 GMT

The Iraqi people and our children here in America could end up becoming seriously ill, losing limbs or even losing their lives to terrorists if we do not maintain our presence in Iraq. Therefore, I want 190 billion to continue funding this war. GWB

Many of your children in this country could end becoming seriously ill, losing limbs or even losing their lives to disease or injury if they are not covered by some form of health care. Therefore, I am vetoing the request for 35 billion to extend health care benefits to these children. GWB

Send the bill back Dems. Take 35 billion to fund Schip out of the 190 billion Bush has asked for to continue his war in Iraq. And because you people are spineless, go ahead and give him the remaining 155 billion for his war in Iraq. Larry from SC is going to write a check for the 155 billion.

The SCHIP Veto

George, Hammonton, NJ — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:39:17 GMT

Once again Bush and the Republicans demonstrate that life is only sacred to them when it is in the womb. Once that sacred life is born, it is on its own. Don't look to the Repubs for health care or assistance...and don't tell me about government run health care...ever hear of the VA? Isn't that health care run by the government...

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jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:39:36 GMT

6 yrs into this president I'm still waiting for the compassion in compassionate conservative. Still waiting for the conservative part as well. Greedy corpratist seems a more accurate discription of bush and his minions.

The SCHIP Veto

pat vavala, Tampa, Fl — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:44:05 GMT

Here is a President who wanted to give all Iraqi's free health care at American taxpayers expense,but refuses to give health care to our children.
George Bush is the worst President this country has ever had, he should be impeached, and turned over to the world court for crimes against humanity.

The SCHIP Veto

Steve Turner Cedar Falls Iowa — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:44:34 GMT

Hmmm. A country unhappy about the Iraq debacle, and now you tell them that poor kids aren't as improtant as Halliburton, I mean 30 Billion bucks? That barely covers the price of the Pappardelle at the Stockholders' brunches. Dubya does have his Priorities straight. Let's see if the Voters do in '08. Dubya's little mob might be on their 'Schip' List.

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Larry Charleston, SC — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:44:52 GMT

Why don't you bring in Jesse MacBeth also, and let's hear what Brian has to say to him. I bet Brian won't be too pleased with Jesse claiming to be a Ranger with a Purple Heart even though he never made it through boot camp. Keith, you're missing the boat. Forget about Rush , let's see how real hero's actually feel about the phonies !

It will never happen - won't get the response needed from the rabid liberals. LOL

The SCHIP Veto

S.Bolinger, St.Louis,MO — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:47:10 GMT

It seems counterintuitive that anyone who is in favor of bringing our troops home ASAP is NOT looking out for their best interests. Besides regular troops there are National Guard and Reservists that never bargained for this type of protracted duty. If only someone had thought of it during the Vietnam conflict-then perhaps GWB would have been one of the 100,000s that never returned.

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Bill Rochester NY — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:47:48 GMT

Rush doesn't have the cojones to face Brian McGough.Like so many on the right he's a bully and an ignorant dishonest one at that.
Only a Republican could possibly believe that 192 Billion dollars on death and destruction is a sounder investment than 35 Billion dollars for healthy American kids.

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O J — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:50:06 GMT

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Vietnam Vet — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:54:51 GMT

perhaps GWB would have been one of the 100,000s that never returned.
S.Bolinger, St.Louis,MO (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 3:47 PM)

Where did that number come from??

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Shag Khaghani, Los Angeles, CA — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 19:56:20 GMT

I thought I'd share this precious quote regarding the proposed increase in cigarette tax to pay for the SCHIP program. This is from yesterday's AP story about the veto:

“White House press secretary Dana Perino said the tax would hit the poor hardest, because smokers tend to fall in the lower-income level. ‘It's just completely irresponsible. Stop the madness on Capitol Hill.’"

Can we start with a straight jacket for the delusional, albeit cute as a button, press secretary?

The SCHIP Veto

Out of work in NY — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:07:51 GMT

Off topic question but why does Bill Clinton charge so
much for him to speak? Does he and the Hilary Empire really need more money?

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jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:15:03 GMT

Here's a fun fact for today. Before we invaded Iraq universal health care. But we are suppose to believe they were the heathens.

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Carol, Long Valley NJ — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:16:41 GMT

To see how the senate votes on any given issue go here.

http://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/legislative/a_three_sections_with_teasers/votes.htm

To see how the house votes on any given issue go here.
http://clerk.house.gov/legislative/legvotes.html

or for 2007 house votes only
http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2007/index.asp

The SCHIP Veto

Disgusted, TX — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:17:19 GMT

Bush doesn't want to "put people on that can afford private insurance." How about if we remove all Congressmen and Senators and people working in the White House from the health benefits provided by the government. They certainly can afford private insurance.

The SCHIP Veto

Frederick Sweeney, Brooklyn — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:17:47 GMT

Steve, Cedar Falls,
Another wonderful post.To the point and funny.
I think the President was quoted as saying this money for SCHIP would lead to socialized medicine. If it makes some of the children in this country healthier who the hell cares what you call it? The kids aren't worth it, but the war is.
We need to vote out as many incumbents as we can, for what they've done and what they have failed to do. Sorry, that was the Catholic in me coming through there. I do believe that the '08 election is going to be a watershed moment in the history of this country. Let's all sacrifice some time and elect some people that realize they work for us, not the other way around.

The SCHIP Veto

jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:22:36 GMT

pat vavala- bush never wanted to give Iraqis health care. His plan was to privatize it like everything else in Iraq. But it turns out after we invaded Iraqis wanted the universal health care they had with Saddam. So they tried to persuade the coalition provisional authority into keeping it, the CPA said no. Now like millions of children in this country without health insurance, they don't even have doctors.

The SCHIP Veto

Bill Heath,Ohio — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:24:07 GMT

The children health bill should ony cover child up to 300 percent of poverty level. someone making $80,000.00 a year they can afford Heath Insurance they just don't want to pay for it.We need to take care of our of our elderly. how may illegals get away with breaking our Health Care System.Lert Move On .Org pay for the Health care they have plenty of funding that they love this country

The SCHIP Veto

jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:35:01 GMT

Because democrates believe they should pay for things when they add them to the budget instead of just borrowing more from China, they proposed adding a dollar a pack tax to cigarettes and adding a tax to cigars to pay for SCHIP. The SCHIP increase was to be 35 billion dollars over 5years. It was supported just about everyone including the insurance industries. The only industry against it is big tabacco. It is clear where bush's loyalties lay.

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jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:36:45 GMT

My fun fact is suppose to read. Before we invaded Iraq, they had universal health care.

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Steven Rennie, Fillmore, NY — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:39:44 GMT

What dishonesty! Why should the government fund health care for kids in families with incomes of $66,000 or more? That's the question the Dems don't answer. Do you know why? Because it's not about the kids, it's about buying the votes of the parents. If it were really about the kids, the Dems would have the cojones to pass a bill calling for universal free health care coverage for all children under age 18 regardless of family income. But they won't because, then, they would have to pass confiscatory tax legislation which would rip the mask off their true motives. This legislation has nothing to do with the kids but we will see more of this dishonesty as the '08 election draws closer. The past is prologue. Anyone remember when the Dems accused Pres. Reagan of forcing millions into homelessness and killing old people? Lies then, lies now. Why should taxpayers, under the guise of a CHILDREN'S health care program be offering coverage to 25 year olds? And why to families at 300% of the poverty level or more? The answer is obvious--to buy the votes of middle class families with kids in college. I'd have more respect for the majority party which had the stones to admit that this kind of legislation is designed to ensure victory at election time whether the majority party was Democratic or Republican.

The SCHIP Veto

ek mpls mn — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:41:00 GMT

Carol -- thanks for the link to the Lautenberg petition.

Krista, this link gives the breakdowns of the house vote on SCHIP

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2007/roll906.xml

The SCHIP Veto

Carol, Long Valley NJ — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:49:59 GMT

Larry Charleston, SC (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 3:44 PM)

No one is pleased with Jesse MacBeth's lies and deceptions. No one left of center, right of center or just plain center can defend the indefensible. So why would any one want to extend his 15 minutes of fame?

What he did was criminal, he got what he deserved. nuff said.

The SCHIP Veto

Jamie, Elmwood Park, IL — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 20:58:51 GMT

Steven Rennie - go to www.factcheck.org regarding SCHIP program as your statement is incorrect. Do you feel the over $2billion each week we spend on the Iraq war is worthwhile?

GO CUBS!

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Ken, MN — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:02:27 GMT

"Bush doesn't want to "put people on that can afford private insurance." How about if we remove all Congressmen and Senators and people working in the White House from the health benefits provided by the government." Disgusted, TX

You are on the mark, Disgusted!!! What a hoot!! Never happen, but great idea. Thanks for the laugh!

The SCHIP Veto

Scott, Columbus, Ohio — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:15:50 GMT

are you all really so lazy to investigate the bill and why it was vetoed? never mind - you all get your info from biased sources so you never even bother to think you've been hoodwinked. Bush himself said he is for a bill helping POOR CHILDREN!!! Since when is a 25 year old in a family earning $80,000 (the age limit and income limit for SCHIP) a POOR CHILD??? It's a back door way for the socialists to start hilarycare without the approval of the American people. and don't give me crappy poll numbers - of course people are going to say yes to a poll question asking if they want FREE health care - but guess what? IT AIN'T FREE!! AND IT AIN'T FOR POOR KIDS!!!!

WE DON'T WANT YOUR STINKING SOCIALIZED MEDICINE!! IT DOESN'T WORK!!

You people have got to be the most ignorant on the face of the earth considering the resources you have to educate yourselves. absolutely pathetic.

The SCHIP Veto

Scott, Columbus, Ohio — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:18:40 GMT

My fun fact is suppose to read. Before we invaded Iraq, they had universal health care. from jen.

Jen,

did that health care coverage include torture chamber and chemical gas injuries or was that a personal expense?

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Velma Hampson Stockton CA — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:21:41 GMT

About Bush and his veto of SCHIP

Where does a man who gets his colonoscopies at Walter Reed and other military hospitals get off deciding that others are not entitled to government sponsored medical care?

The SCHIP Veto

jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:39:53 GMT

I think the richest country in the world should provide health care for all of it's citizens. We pay more for health care than any other country yet 36 other countries provide better care. I now pay $200 a month for a policy with a $5000 deductable. That doesn't cover my asthma. The system of health care we now have in our country is nothing more than legalized extortion. All anyone has to do to find this out is get sick and discover the "great" insurance you used to have and are still paying for, no longer covers any illness humans get.

The SCHIP Veto

Bill Rochester NY — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:44:19 GMT

All these people complaining about the cost of the SCHIP program and the fact that the Dems want to cover families at 300% of the poverty level obviously have never had to pay for health insurance themselves.
FACT 300% of the poverty level for a family of four is not $80,000 a year, more like $45,000 a year.
Fact When I first entered the work force employers routinely paid all health insurance premiums. Now it is the EXTREMELY RARE employer that does so. Many employers won't pick up dime one of health insurance premiums these days. So how is a family supposed to be kept fed, sheltered, and clothed when health insurance premiums will eat up their "discretionary income" ?
Of course the righties on this blog (and off it) reveal their true nature. "I've got mine and F*$& you get your own on your own"

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jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:46:16 GMT

Steve Rennie- There are currently about 1.5 million homeless people in the US thanks to reagan. About 150,000 vietnam vets or 3 times the number of soldiers who died in vietnam are now homeless. Please know that if you ever get sick or fall on hard times me and my liberal, socialist, commie, bleeding heart, dirt worshipping, whale lovers will be there to help you. Funny, but I have never run into a republican volunteer at a soup kitchen.

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jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:49:07 GMT

Scott- If they survived they could go to the hospital. That's more than they can do now.

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Bill Rochester NY — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:50:33 GMT

Tell me Scott what is your source for the claim that "Stinking Socialized medicine doesn't Work"?
Gee all of Western Europe has it. Guess what they're all very happy with it. Indicators of quality of life (such as life expectancy) show that it works quite well.
There are two words that seem to cause irrational fear in Right Wing Americans they are: 1) socialism, and 2) evolution.

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Bill Rochester NY — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:52:06 GMT

Jen you never will either

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Krista Swisher, Indianapolis, IN — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:52:22 GMT

I KNEW NewsHole bloggers wouldn't let me down!!! Many thanks to Carol (4:16 pm post) and EK (4:41 pm post) for the links! EK's link is the direct link to the "roll call" vote - who specifically voted for it, who specifically voted against it, etc. If any representatives in the "Nay" column are in your district, email them, call them, write them, whatever it takes to TRY to get them to grow a heart more than 2 sizes too small, or at least get them to try to explain themselves with a straight face.

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jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:52:51 GMT

Scott Columbus- It must be nice to be so stinking rich you don't have to worry about how you will pay for an illness. 60% of bankruptcies in this country are filed by people who got sick and couldn't pay. 75% of those people had insurance when they got sick.

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jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:54:01 GMT

Bill Rochester- Nicely said!

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Scott Copeland, Naples, Fl — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:55:18 GMT

"You people have got to be the most ignorant on the face of the earth considering the resources you have to educate yourselves. absolutely pathetic."

Naw, kool-aid drinking idiots that worship Rush, Billo, and Bush, and spend their time disrupting boards with their asinine, dishonest, and unwanted opinions, are MUCH more pathetic than Keith's ecclectic collection of fans and supporters.

There are none so blind as those that can not see.

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Vietnam Vet — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:56:03 GMT

jen,il (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 5:46 PM)
Funny, but I have never run into a republican volunteer at a soup kitchen.

I've never met a rupublican or democrat volunteer at a soup kitchen, I just met volunteers.

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Carol, Long Valley NJ — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:57:48 GMT

Welcome back Scott, Columbus, Ohio, I missed your informed opinion -- the trolls on this blog publish such drivel it's hard to read them.

With regards to the $80k -- in northern NJ that IS the poverty line. Try getting a 1 bedroom apartment in my neck of the woods for less than $1200/month. It's not available. Little houses start at $300k and the McMansions go for over $1 million.

I pay over $10,000 a year for my HMO health plan and it only covers myself, my husband and my 21 year old son. I'd welcome 'stinking socialized medicine' if it would take away filling out medical forms and fighting with the insurance companies to finally pay up. I'd consider it a blessing.

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irony — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:59:00 GMT

Please know that if you ever get sick or fall on hard times me and my liberal, socialist, commie, bleeding heart, dirt worshipping, whale lovers will be there to help you. Funny, but I have never run into a republican volunteer at a soup kitchen.
jen,il (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 5:46 PM)

I think I hear Cuba calling. I didn't realize it was such a paradise down there.

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Christina, Helena, AL — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 21:59:24 GMT

"Bush doesn't want to "put people on that can afford private insurance." How about if we remove all Congressmen and Senators and people working in the White House from the health benefits provided by the government." Disgusted, TX

That is precicely what I said in a letter to to my Congressmen last month! Their response? A large round of indifference.

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jen,il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:00:18 GMT

To all the righties out there let me make one thing clear. I WANT SOCIALIZED MEDICINE. I'm happy to pay more taxs for it because socialized medicine is better than no health care. which is currently the only choice 47 million of my fellow citizens have. If we are suppose to be the greatest country in the world we need to start acting like it.

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Disgusted, TX — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:00:57 GMT

Scott, universal health care and/or SCHIPS is not socialized medicine. It is socialized insurance. And if ever a country needed socialized insurance, it is this one. Americans spend far more on health care per person than Canadians, Australians, and British.

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Peter G V/T — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:01:43 GMT

The simple fact is when health care gets socialized. The quality and of health care drops. China, USSR, CUba, N. Korea

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LT in MD — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:02:42 GMT

Scott, Columbus, Ohio (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 5:15 PM)

Thanks Scott for yet another uninformed inner-rage NeoConNutJob rant. The Schip healthcare plan is supposed to cover the children who would normally fall through the cracks so to speak. I don't suppose any of the self-entitled Neo-trolls pay monthly health insurance premiums? For a family of 4 making 60 or even 85,000 a year, if their employer doesn't cover the insurance premiums, the cost is astronomical.

The poorest among us are the one's who benefit the most from Schip, but don't let the facts get in your way..you have your mythical 25 year old's to worry about..
I hate to say this about fellow Americans, but portions of the RightWingers are seriously deranged.. If you folks really have that much anger and hatred towards the "Other Side", it is a truly scary phenomenon to behold. Thanks a bunch GWB, you uniter you.

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Neill C., Montgomery, Al — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:03:23 GMT

The troops know who supports them and it isn't the people who claim they are terrorizing people at night and it isn't the people calling them losers and it isn't the people who voted for the 87 billion before they voted against it.

Grow up, Olbermann. All this is, is retaliation for the lowdown scummy attack on General Petraeus. Why don't you ask the troops who'd they'd rather have come visit them? Scumbag democrats like Reid, Kerry, or Murtha, or Rush Limbaugh. No, you won't ask them because you're a child petulantly trying to get back at Rush.

And we're all still waiting for Murtha to apologize to the soldiers he claimed committed atrocities, subsequently proved false.

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Carol, Long Valley NJ — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:03:59 GMT

jen,il (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 5:46 PM)

You are so correct with your observation.

I've never run into a Republican at the United Way fund raisers, or the Amercian Heart Association Heart Walks -- in fact, the R's are the ones who won't even put a d-mn dollar in the fund raising envelope. I have a hard time getting them to donate blood. (I wear many hats at work).

I firmly believe in Karma -- and these selfish individuals will get what is coming to them.

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Neill C, Montgomery, Al. — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:05:22 GMT

It's funny, all these liberals scream and complain about Bush's spending and complain about giving money to rich people, but when it's THEM giving money to rich people, well, then that's OK.

Democrats = hypocrisy.

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Neill C., Montgomery, Al — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:09:33 GMT

Bill Rochester NY. It's called stop digging into my pocket for your bad choices life.

If you think they should get this, get all your liberal friends to pony up for it out of your own pockets. Oh, that's right, you only want to raise taxes when you can force it on the rest of us who don't want to raise taxes.

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MaryS, Poway, Calif. — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:10:30 GMT

Do you supposed Tony Snow was able to keep his superb health insurance when he the White House? He certainly wouldn't be able to get insurance out here in the real world -- at any price.

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Full Moon — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:13:29 GMT

ROCKIES WIN 4-2. YES !!!!

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Lisa, Fort Worth TX — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:17:11 GMT

Those who whine about socialized medicine should DEMAND that our congress and WH personnel give up their government sponsored healthcare NOW! Like some have said, if it benefits the rich right, defense contractors, or utility companies, the money can always be found. Corporate welfare for companies with record-breaking profits are just fine thank you, but we can't possibly come up with a tiny percentage of what we've spent killing people to save any lives! It makes me ashamed to be an American citizen.

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Full Moon — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:21:50 GMT

I'm tired of the Yankees, Red Sox, etc., but as long as the Giants and Barry Bonds didn't win anything this year I'm happy. Now it looks like Barry won't have a home next year. The Giants have said NO WAY to another contract. And having an asterisk on the baseball going into the Hall of Fame is the icing on the cake.

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Carol, Long Valley NJ — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:22:50 GMT

http://www.factcheck.org/bushs_false_claims_about_childrens_health_insurance.html

I triple dog dare the posters to the right of center to read the FACTS posted at this site.

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S Vickers Fl — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:23:15 GMT

Why doesn't Keith hop on a plane take a trip to Iraq, or Afghanistan explain what he's taliking about to the troops that he "suports", and get feedback from them. Celebrities are doing it every day now.

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Christie S. Hollywood, Fl. — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:25:08 GMT

I am a mother of two children born with serious congenital problems. The bills added up in the millions and my insurance would not cover siting the problems as pre-existing. I paid on these for over 20 years till I finally took out Bankruptcy. I have worked all my life and have no savings or retirement because of health care costs. I made too much to qualify for Medicaid and was charged as all uninsured the highest rates by doctors and hospitals. I am an RN and watch families where both parents work but do not have the benifit of insurance being destroyed by an illness or accident. It is a tragedy for a country who calls itself the "greatest in the world" to treat its' children in such a manner. My children are grown and my husband works for our local school system where we pay $500 a month for an HMO for two people. The cost for a family of four is $900 a month. Something must be done and our President should be ashamed.

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Nanalinda, San Antonio, TX — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:30:54 GMT

What happened to compassionate conservatism?
If those who agree with Bush so much think that he's right, I hope they're tithing at church on Sunday. If they do so with a good heart, there might be some funds left (after they've finished building their mega-churches) to help the poor with their medical bills.
I know what Jesus would do.

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kaybee, Lewiston, Maine — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:34:04 GMT

And Bush claims to be a Christian! He is the worst hypocrite of the free world. Someone should ask him, "What would Jesus do?" Why doesn't someone call him to the carpet? Hey Keith, oh Keith, do your thing, Oh Great One. (I'm serious!)

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Michael D. Gwizdala, Albany, New York — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:34:06 GMT

Why do President Bush and Republicans in Congress hate our children? What a jerk, of all the things to veto, the SCHIP program. This is the same President who essentially told everyone during the flu vaccination shortage a few years ago, "just don't get sick and you'll be ok." Just brilliant George. "Childrens do get sick," George and you sir are one sick pup!

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Laura in Los Angeles — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:36:59 GMT

As an employer paying 100% of health care for my employees, I find it very difficult to keep this going. It is extremely expensive to pay according to one's age. My HMO in the last few years, has increased rates according to age. Since 1/3 of my employees are middle aged, the cost is prohibitive. Something better needs to come along to save $$. Socialized insurance, socialized medicine, whatever you want to call it, seems to be cheaper. I have the added burden of paying into California's Workers Comp system according to my company payroll. This, in my opinion, is a waste of money. To be fair California should charge companies not offering insurance, not my company which does. Now Gov. Arnie wants to pass legislation for employers to help fund insurance for those who don't have it. I haven't read all there is to this, but it doesn't sound like a good thing. I don't want to deny my employees their health care, but I may have to charge them to pay for at least 1/3 of what I pay for them. I don't know if the cost of medical care will ever change. There is just too much money to be made by insurance companies.

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Waiting for Hilary's tax bomb — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:38:01 GMT

To all the righties out there let me make one thing clear. I WANT SOCIALIZED MEDICINE
jen,il (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 6:00 PM)

Well go northy or southy until you get someplace that they offer it

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Rick, Los Angeles, CA — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:42:42 GMT

HELLO

The bill imposes a new federal tax (.45 House version, .61 Senate version) on all tobacco products sold to help pay for SCHIP.

It all comes down to protecting the FAT CATS with deep pockets in the tobacco industry.

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Scott Copeland, Naples, Fl — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:43:39 GMT

"It's funny, all these liberals scream and complain about Bush's spending and complain about giving money to rich people, but when it's THEM giving money to rich people, well, then that's OK.

Democrats = hypocrisy."

Some of us with kids would rather see our tax dollars spent improving this country before we go fixing anybody elses. Why don't you talk to all the middle-class parents who have kids with autism, who can't buy private health insurance for ANY amount money if they aren't covered by employee healthcare, like the President, our congressmen, and senators enjoy.

You trolls (and our own politicians) can insist till the cow come home that bringing democracy to Iraq is more important that helping American children and our fellow Americans, but that doesn't change the truth.

Neil=idiot

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Laura in Los Angeles — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:45:05 GMT

Peter B V/T 6:01 PM..I have two friends living in Sweden. Socialized medicine there. Works like a charm, has for decades. They are very happy with it. Not only that, they take care of their sick and elderly. Many other European countries have socialized medicine as well. The word people are so "scared" of when socialized medicine is brought up is the word "communism". Don't ask me why. My dad told me this decades ago, he was a smart man so I wasn't at an age to ask him why. He is gone now so I can't ask him.

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Intillectual Avatar, Denver, CO — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:50:21 GMT

Scott, Columbus, Ohio (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 5:15 PM)

said:

"Since when is a 25 year old in a family earning $80,000 (the age limit and income limit for SCHIP) a POOR CHILD???"

Middle class kids with free healthcare?!?!?! Oh the horror! Tear out my eyes so I don't have to see the eeeevvvviiiillllll!!!!!!!!

Anyway, So what? What if it does cover a kid with a family that earns $80,000 a year until he's 25? You're telling me that if this was your kid, you wouldn't accept free healthcare based purely on principle?

Besides that, even if you were making $80,000 a year, what happens if your kid gets cancer and you suddenly have $100,000 of medical bills (possible even with insurance)?

You're so worried about "socialism" that you are totally missing the point. What point you ask? The point is that no one (yes, NO ONE) should ever have to choose between the health of their child and going bankrupt.

That's called being moral bubbo. And no, you don't make a profit off of it. I know, it's radical, but you really ought to try it some time.

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Nanalinda, San Antonio, TX — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 22:56:58 GMT

Neill C.
I can't believe that you think this war is free of charge. Bush hasn't raised your taxes (too chicken), but whoever wins in Nov 08, taxes will go up. I suppose you still believe in Santa Claus & the Tooth Fairy. We are all going to have to pay for Bush's bad choices, not just those who support them.

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Carol, Long Valley NJ — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:14:28 GMT

W's ACCOMPLISHMENTS AS PRESIDENT: (part 1)

I am the first President in U.S. history to enter office with a criminal record.

I invaded and occupied two countries at a continuing cost of over one billion dollars per week.

I spent the U.S. surplus and effectively bankrupted the U.S. Treasury.

I shattered the record for the largest annual deficit in U.S. history.

I set an economic record for most private bankruptcies filed in any 12-month period.

I set the all-time record for most foreclosures in a 12-month period.

I set the all-time record for the biggest drop in the history of the U.S. stock market.

In my first year in office, over 2 million Americans lost their jobs and that trend continues every month.

I'm proud that the members of my cabinet are the richest of any administration in U.S. history. My "poorest millionaire," Condoleeza Rice, has a Chevron oil tanker named after her.

I set the record for most campaign fund-raising trips by a U.S. President.

I am the all-time U.S. and world record-holder for receiving the most corporate campaign donations.

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US politics — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:18:27 GMT

Another republican retireing from office. Pretty soon the Democrats are gonna run out of excuses why they can't get things done in congress.

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D.E. Dawsey Columbia, Ms. — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:19:31 GMT

Bush has got to be a MORON. If Congress had any cojones they would charge Bush and his cohorts with Treason for starting his Iraq War, and wouldn't be concerned with the head Wimp's veto.
rojo, ms.

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Matt, Il — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:20:01 GMT

Where is the democracy? A majority want us out of Iraq. A majority wanted Shrub to pass SCHIP. Funny how Shrub is shoving democracy down the Middle Easts throat when he does not live by it here. Someone remind him that the only reason he is president is the Electoral College and not democracy.

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nuanced — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:21:40 GMT

right on jen,il and don't forget the tree-huggers

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O J — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:24:55 GMT

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nuanced — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:25:06 GMT

Neill C., a little testy today? As my father used to say "don't blow a gasket"

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S vickers, Fl — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:31:18 GMT

Carol, Long Valley NJ (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 7:14 PM)
I set the all-time record for the biggest drop in the history of the U.S. stock market.

I could have sworn the market was at an all time high this week. This must have been written in error and credbility records are only as good as your last mistake. Who's next?

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J. Reid NY — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:33:08 GMT

Lets not forget he recovered he came into office at the satrt of recession in 1999 and got to recover in the fastest time ever

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Diane Sallis, MS — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:34:53 GMT

Bush does not have a moral compass. It's all about greed. More for the rich, the poor or working class in this country can fend for themselfs. If you work for a living under this bunch your on your own. Keep the tax dollars comming and by the way this government no longer works for you. Sorry about your luck.

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Peter G V/T — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:46:02 GMT

Washington College poll
A Washington College poll about presidential greatness, taken 11 February 2005, asked 800 adults nationwide, "Thinking about all the presidents of the United States throughout history to the present, who would you say was America's greatest president?"

Abraham Lincoln (20%)
Ronald Reagan (15%)
Franklin D. Roosevelt (12%)
John F. Kennedy (11%)
Bill Clinton (10%)
Other/Don't Know (9%)
George W. Bush (8%)
George Washington (6%)
Theodore Roosevelt (3%)
Dwight Eisenhower (3%)
Jimmy Carter (2%)
Thomas Jefferson (2%)
Richard Nixon (1%)
John Adams (<1%)
Andrew Jackson (<1%)
Lyndon Johnson (<1%)

Gallup poll

Ronald Reagan has fared well in recent public opinion pollsA Gallup poll about presidential greatness, taken February 9-11, 2007, asked 1006 adults nationwide, "Who do you regard as the greatest United States president?"

Abraham Lincoln (18%)
Ronald Reagan (16%)
John F. Kennedy (14%)
Bill Clinton (13%)
Franklin Roosevelt (9%)
Other/None/No opinion (8%)
George Washington (7%)
Harry Truman (3%)
George W. Bush (2%)
Theodore Roosevelt (2%)
Dwight Eisenhower (2%)
Thomas Jefferson (2%)
Jimmy Carter (2%)
Gerald Ford (1%)
George H.W. Bush (1%)
Richard Nixon (-%)

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politics — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:50:31 GMT

If you like US policy as it is today and want to guarantee that it stays for another 4-5 years than cast your ticket for the democratic party in 2008.

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Nanalinda, San Antonio, TX — Wed, 03 Oct 2007 23:52:21 GMT

CA had it right. Those who support the war should pay for it out of their taxes. Those who support SCHIP should pay for that out of their taxes. Before too long those who support the war will be begging for socialized health care and an end to war.
As Colin Powell once said, you break it, you own it.

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Full Moon — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 00:51:39 GMT

C A - Stop the nit-picking and whining. Do it for Smearmaster Harry Reid and the far left liberal insanity. Do it for Springsteen and Penn, and the ghost of Pelosi. Now and forever.

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James, San Diego, CA — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 00:52:21 GMT

Let's be fair here. The bill is supposed to be about giving health coverage to poor children. 25 year olds making $84,000 are not poor children.

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puffin — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 01:24:32 GMT

I believe the Democrats have taken a cowardly approach to funding SCHIP and I hope they fix it before the next go-round. Rather than fund this worthwhile program from general revenues and take the heat for a possible tax increase, they chose instead to target a much-demonized minority.

If you believe the current propaganda that only the uneducated lower classes smoke, then you have to think that it's is a regressive tax. And if you believe that raising the tax will reduce smoking, then where do you think the funding for "health insurance for needy children" is headed? It doesn't make sense to fund a needed program that will need room to grow with a funding source that is expected to decline.

The sixty-one cent per pack increase is not a tax on the tobacco companies. It's a tax on people who don't fit the bourgeois paradigm of what you're currently "supposed to do". It's an obnoxious and mean-spirited piece of social engineering and deserves to be vetoed, even if by the wrong person for all the wrong reasons.

Democrats should find another, more progressive, way to fund SCHIP. To fund it by taxing a sitting duck minority is cowardly and a bad precedent.

Otherwise, all Democrats should do their part and take up smoking...for the children, you know.

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Larry Charleston, Sc — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 01:53:46 GMT

Carol, that all sounds like the economy of NJ. Remember the great tax on yachts that sent everyone to NY to buy theirs , bankrupted your own NJ businesses. The economy is great , stock market highest ever. If you're not taking advantage of it you are the loser.

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Larry Charleston, SC — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 02:11:08 GMT

Hey I got a great idea that will save billions in the health care market. Let's stop the trial lawyers from filing frivilous lawsuits against doctors and lawyers and drug companies. Malpractice insurance drives up the cost of medical services tremendously. I know the liberals won't mind pissing off one of their great constituancies for the good of the CHILDREN. To repeat - trial lawyers are hurting our CHILDREN ! ( According to Hillary's playbook, mention CHILDREN and everyone will support it ) . John Edwards made millions filing these lawsuits , so he is the problem hurting the children's healthcare.

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Harry, Nevada — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 02:13:05 GMT

Put Pelosi's 3some with Whoopi on pay per view and we'll have enough $ for free healthcare for everyone ! Great idea Babara Walters !

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Lee, Orlando Florida — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 02:16:52 GMT

Way to go George "no kids left behind huh? How many just got left behind with that nice little veto".

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puffin — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 04:10:17 GMT

I would wholeheartedly support SCHIP. But the funding plan for SCHIP calls for increasing taxes on only one segment of the population…that maligned minority, smokers. At sixty-one cents per pack, our household taxes would increase by $435 per year…almost one percent of our net income. That is grossly regressive and terribly unfair.

What’s most troubling about it is that the rationale for this tax is that it might cause smokers to quit. If you follow that line of logic, the people who theoretically support SCHIP are hoping to see it de-funded.

SCHIP deserves to be vetoed, even if by the wrong person for the wrong reasons. And the Democrats need to find a fairer way of funding it next time it’s proposed. Here’s a novel idea….how about reducing the funding for the war and using the money for SCHIP? Gee, you think you could get the current crop of Democrats to go for it?

In the meantime, I think all good Democrats have an obligation to take up smoking. After all, it’s for the children.

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puffin — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 04:10:47 GMT

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Tony B — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 04:19:05 GMT

I the report on the SCHIP veto, Countdown identified Sen, Charles Grassley as being from Nebraska. He is from Iowa.

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Phyllis — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 04:30:27 GMT

Here is the page for the SCHIP vote in the house.

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2007/roll906.xml

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Mary Lyons-Barrett, PhD — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 04:34:56 GMT

Dear Mr. Olbermann,
I really enjoy your show, but your captioner had under Sen. Chuck Grassley that he is a Republican from Nebraska. He is a Republican from Iowa and he took a courageous stand. Maybe you were thinking of our maverick Republican from Nebraska Sen. Chuck Hagel. Keep up the good work. Prof. Mary Lyons-Barrett

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Sue, Syracuse, NY — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:19:18 GMT

Excretory Bush can't possibly approve money for children - he wants all OUR taxpayer dollars to go to BLACKWATER killers and HALLIBURTON pirates.
Republicans and Democrats who value their jobs should OVERRIDE THIS IDIOT'S VETO NOW.

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C A, Tuscaloosa, AL — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:29:01 GMT

Full Moon (8:51 PM Post): It seems to me it is those on the far extreme right like you here that are doing the whining. The rest of us want change and are willing to try different ideas to improve US domestic and foreign policy. We have even ask those on the right to get a litte creative and to come along and make suggestions too. But, nope you guys are scared of your own shadows, call anything that might help people socialism, and want to let Bush make all the decisions for you. Then when others suggest perhaps a different path (at least asking just to discuss and review different options), you people get all in a tizzy, start the name calling and act like the biggest whinnies west of Rio Grande. So I believe Moon it is people like you and others on the far right who do most the whinning. It is actually quite funny to watch.

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Kevin of NJ — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:29:23 GMT

Funny, but I have never run into a republican volunteer at a soup kitchen.
jen,il (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 5:46 PM)

That is a ridiculous generalization. I am a republican, and give my time to many worthwhile causes including Habitat for Humanity etc. I agree with Vietnam Vet, they are just volunteers. Why do you left leaners have to make sweeping generalizations that are not based on any facts. Look at the facts, socialized medicine will reduce the level of care you receive.

Carol of NJ, do you think that you will magically get your insurance for free under Hillary care. Those costs estimates of those programs will guaranteed to be underestimated, as is ALL government run programs. You think you have red tape with your HMO, wait til the government gets ahold of it. You all gripe about how the government is incompetent, the government can't get anything done, but you want to turn over national healthcare to them. That is a scary thought

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Kevin of NJ — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:33:44 GMT

How much more time are we going to spend on Rush Limbaugh. Funny, the mainstream media pushed the moveon ads controversy back to the back pages in a few short days. Now, in the midst of the furor over a misinterpretation of comments by a RADIO HOST, there is no mention.

Wow, you can call a 4 star general a traitor, but god forbid we call the likes of Jessy Macbeth and those similar to him phony (Which is what they are), the story will last for days. Keith, your blatant obsession of Bill O and hypocritical rants about only certain statements will eventually lead to your downfall.

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Kevin of NJ — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:38:59 GMT

The poorest among us are the one's who benefit the most from Schip, but don't let the facts get in your way..you have your mythical 25 year old's to worry about..

LT in MD (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 6:02 PM)

You would be covered under the plan Bush was proposing.

"I don't suppose any of the self-entitled Neo-trolls pay monthly health insurance premiums? For a family of 4 making 60 or even 85,000 a year, if their employer doesn't cover the insurance premiums, the cost is astronomical. "

If you are classifying me as a "neotroll", then yes I do pay about $1,000 per month for my family's health coverage. Plus I have deductibles to meet, etc.

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MK, Indianapolis — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:40:09 GMT

Isn't the program increasing by $5 billion ? Why do we need to cover individuals to age 25 ? Regular policies drop children at age 19 unless a full time student. Sounds to me like Hillary has something to do with this, too close to Universal Healthcare. Why not only tax those who favor this program, like everyone on this site is saying about the war tax ?
What's good for the goose......
John, Phila (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 2:48 PM)

Do people from age 19 to age 25 need health care coverage? Or, should we let them eat cake? Do you not think that if a 20 year old get sick or in an accident that it costs some hospital somewhere real money to save their life? Why shouldn't all the people in our great Country have health care? Hasn't the war already increased by billions of dollars?

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Scott, columbus, ohio — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:47:20 GMT

Dear reactionaries,

Socialized health care does NOT work

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=270338135202343

this is just one example. It doesn't work because it doesn't provide incentive or enough $ to keep the hospitals and doctors running at peak efficiency. As a result, you have enormous waits for any kind of medicine and God help you if you need emergency surgery or any kind of emergency service.

As far as it being socialized insurance, that's BS. It's just Socialized medicine's foot in the door. I would have NO problem with requiring everyone to BUY their own insurance like we require everyone to BUY car insurance. I would have no problem assisting POOR people buy their own insurance, but when a 25 year old making $80,000 is just given coverage something is wrong. That young person is spending there money foolishly on other things, because they CAN afford insurance if they wanted to. Sell your car and buy a beater. Drop your cable. Stop buying new clothes. Priorities, man!! Buying your health insurance should be in your top three expenditure priorities yet you people somehow got the idea that it's the government's job to take care of you, not your own. SCHIP is NOT a safety net, it is intended to take kids off of private coverage and put them into public coverage.

Also, I agree that our current insurance system DEFINITELY needs a lot of tweaking but socialism is not the answer. Bill, this is a big reason why you see Western Europe racing away from socialism as fast as they can. See France.

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Larry Charleston, SC — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 13:22:59 GMT

Lee , no kids left behind - only 25 year olds from families making $83,000 per year. Maybe tort reform will lessen the cost of healthcare for everyone. Tell the liberals to let go of the Trial Lawyer's and do what's right.

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C A, Tuscalooosa, AL — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 13:56:39 GMT

Irony (5:59 PM Post): Come on Irony. I thought you were a more responsible and serious debater of the issues then that. Jen'il deserves some respect for her compassion for people whether you agree with her position on this issue or not. Have you ever been to Cuba Irony. I have, several times, and although I do not like Castro's way of governing people the Cuban people themselves are fine folks who take care of one another when others are in need. The people of Cuba are not divided and at each others throats like those here in the US. Ever see the comments from Kruchev Irony after Kennedy booted the Russians out of Cuba. Kruchev exclaimed no big deal, the US will destroy itself from within. All we have to do is wait. This division and downright nastiness between people, those from the right and yes some from the left, do more damage to this country then any social health care program could for kids. For those who think this program is a socialist program that they do not support, how about some decent suggestions on how to provide heatlh care services to those young kids (say ages 12 and lower) who have none due to their social / economic status.

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junebug — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 14:58:56 GMT

Scott, Columbus, Ohio, I suggest that YOU read the bill and get your information from unbiased sources. Your post was wrong on SO many levels.

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Bradley, Iraq — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 15:09:35 GMT

The despair some of you are uttering in response to the President's veto sounds troublingly like the question "who is John Galt?" Has the idea that the wellfare of one's family is dependent on the productivity of that family's breadwinner died? Is the care of one's children no longer an individual responsibility?

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Bill Rochester NY — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:16:03 GMT

Peter G V/T Here's a list for you SFB. Sweden, Finland, Norway, Denmark, Germany, Belgium, The Netherlands, France, Italy, Spain , Great Britain, Canada, Japan, Luxembourg, Switzerland, Austria, Czech Republic, Portugal. All with national health insurance.

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Dee — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:22:41 GMT

Steven Rennie, Fillmore, NY (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 4:39 PM)

Where does the bill say anything about coverage up to age 25?

In reading the text of the bill, I see a reference to OPTIONAL coverage up to age 21 but nothing about coverage to age 25 optional or otherwise.

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Bill Rochester NY — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:24:47 GMT

Neil C. in Montgomery. I was not aware that a nation's investment in its citizenry was putting my hands in YOUR POCKETS to pay for my bad choices?
People who suffer debilitating injuries, those who are diagnosed with awful potentially teminal illnesses actually CHOSE to have those things happen to them? Gee I know a few cancer patients who'd love to hear that their illnesses are their own fault.
Since the Dem's are proposing to pay for the SCHIPS expansion by raising the tax on cigarettes. How is that putting my hand in your pocket for my bad choices? Unless of course you smoke but then that's your bad choice not mine.

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Kevin of NJ — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 17:48:32 GMT

I've never run into a Republican at the United Way fund raisers, or the Amercian Heart Association Heart Walks -- in fact, the R's are the ones who won't even put a d-mn dollar in the fund raising envelope. I have a hard time getting them to donate blood. (I wear many hats at work).

I firmly believe in Karma -- and these selfish individuals will get what is coming to them.

Carol, Long Valley NJ (Sent Wednesday, October 03, 2007 6:03 PM)

Wow, what a ridiculous statement to make. I know several Republicans that are very charitable and give of their time. Several are members of my church, who commit countless hours to homeless shelters, and other worthwhile causes. How dare you make that generalization. I am deeply offended by that accusation. For the record, I have helped out with handicapped underprivelaged children, Dream come true, United Way, and Habitat for Humanity. You have been listening to pompous keith o too much. What a shame, I thought you were above that.

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C A, Tuscaloosa, AL — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 17:56:51 GMT

Here's the rub. A good and intelligent leader (deciding to veto an important bill and angering many American people) would immediately call a press conference to A) state he/she had vetoed the bill and he/she was aware that the intent of the bill appears to be popular with a lrage portion of the country B) point out the specific reasons why he/she vetoed the bill and C) repeat his/her desire to provide health care for disadvantaged children and then communicate to Congress that if this or that item were changed in the bill he/she would agree to approve the bill. But, no one ever accused Bush of being a great leader or communicator, so we go on guessing and arguing as to the specifics and intentions of the bill, Bush and the Republicans lose even more credability with many American people, and the disadvantaged kids who may have acquired needed health care go on without it. On an issue as important as this we expect leadership from a President who would immediately seek compromise with Congress to get the deserving kids covered without further delay. The President should take the lead and pursue the compromise with vigor rather than waiting for Congress to send him another bill or a compromised version of the original bill. Has anyone heard driectly from Bush as to all the details and reasons he vetoed the bill ( I said from Bush himself and not some robot spokesperson)? Anyone heard of any pursuit by Bush of a compromise bill he could approve? I thought so.

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S.Bolinger — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 18:30:30 GMT

So sorry I was lead-fingered-I meant to type 10,000s-just under 60,000. Once again VERY sorry the National Guard was NOT deployed then along with "the boy genius" GWB.

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C A, Tuscaloosa, AL — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 18:41:08 GMT

Well, I see that Bush did try and explain why he vetoed the Schip bill at a Lancaster Chamber of Commerce meeting, and made it quite clear that he has not a clue as to the specifics of the bill. It is obvious that Bush never read the bill but had a yohoo right wing neo-con aide give him some very general and inaccurate information and reasons why he should veto the bill. Now that is called leadership ladies and gentlemen. The chump never read the bill, and even if he just scanned it, he did not comprehend what he had read. What a world.

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junebug — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 19:29:09 GMT

Hey, Larry . . . WRONG. I work in the legal profession defending the doctors you're talking about and sorry, you're just wrong. How unusual is that?

Med Mal insurance is going up because insurance companies WANT it to go up. Insurance companies make money off of these lawsuits . . . ever hear of the term "reserves"? They determine what it will cost to settle a case or what the projected judgment will be . . . they put that money into interest-bearing "reserves." By the time the case settles or is ajudicated, those reserves have grown significantly. While there are frivolous lawsuits filed occasionally, they do not make up the largest percentage of cases . . . they're just the ones that make the news.

Stick to trash talking . . . you at least have that down pat.

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junebug — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 19:31:02 GMT

C.A., I read part of the transcript of that talk in Pennsylvania . . . I don't think he has the ability to comprehend much of anything anymore. Very scary transcript. Unbelievable.

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junebug — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 19:35:31 GMT

"SCHIP is NOT a safety net, it is intended to take kids off of private coverage and put them into public coverage."

Scott,Columbus. Where do you get this BS? My brother worked at a HUGE regional children's health care facility for 25 years. They treat critically ill children on a daily basis . . . without SCHIP, many of the children they serve could not survive and their families would go bankrupt.

I don't understand folks who just spout something that they've heard Rush or Sean or whoever they listen to (even Keith) without checking the FACTS.

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Carol, Long Valley NJ — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 19:36:16 GMT

Kevin of NJ (Sent Thursday, October 04, 2007 1:48 PM)

You are correct, it was wrong of me to make such an generalization, I apologize.

It was only my observation, based on all the fund raising and volunteer work that I do.

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Full Moon — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 19:43:58 GMT

C A - Of course you can't and won't accept it but you're wrong. And should you feel an urge to answer this blog, try to keep it to a sentence or two. You are extremely long-winded.

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Larry Charleston, SC — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 19:47:46 GMT

Junebug, so the Insurance companies are in cahoots with the trial lawyers , who are the major donors of the liberals ? Now it all makes sense. No wonder Tort reform will never take place , everyone is making money on lawsuits - except the poor person suing.

BTW, Sue from Wisc just stated that insurance companies cannot be sued. As a retired RN , she should know better. Can we ever believe anythind she says again ? LOL

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junebug — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 20:12:45 GMT

"Junebug, so the Insurance companies are in cahoots with the trial lawyers , who are the major donors of the liberals ? Now it all makes sense. No wonder Tort reform will never take place , everyone is making money on lawsuits - except the poor person suing."

In addition to not knowing what the hell you're talking about, you also seem to have a comprehension problem. Nowhere did I say that insurance companies were "in cahoots with the trial lawyers." Since the concept of reserves and the concept of insurance companies continuing to make huge profits in SPITE of large jury awards (it's the JURIES who award damages, not trial lawyers, by the way) seem to be beyond your realm of comprehension, I'll just let you keep spouting BS. Most folks here know your limitations.

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junebug — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 20:15:06 GMT

Insurance companies may only be sued for certain things . . . I'm not sure what context Sue was talking about, but there are limitations.

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Carol, Long Valley NJ — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 20:23:10 GMT

junebug (Sent Thursday, October 04, 2007 4:12 PM)

game, set, point.

I learn so much from your posts. Thank you.

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C A, Tuscaloosa, AL — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 21:24:10 GMT

Carol (4:23 PM Post): I might agree and do appreciate junebug's understanding and knowledge of the issues. But with regard to "game, set, point, you cannot win aganist the likes of Wayne and Larry and True Liberal Scott and some others. Winning means that the opponent has enough sense, integrity and humility to acknowledge defeat win they are beaten and to congratulate their opponent. Do you see those characterestics in these people? It does little good to rejoice in victory when those you have defeated don't understand what defeat is. Kudos to junebug however for her ability to uncover and expose idiocy. Larry did agree to give the entire 190 billion to our young military personnel in Iraq. That may be a start.

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Scott, Columbus, ohio — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 21:29:11 GMT

junebug,

so the insurance companies grand scheme is to insure doctors, hope they get sued so they can take money out of their other investments or operating funds and put it into a low yield liquid fund and THEN they can cash in on the 3-4% they likely earn? brilliant. you are clueless.

also, because your brother works in health care and sees sick kids on a daily basis that means my argument is bunk and SCHIP is the best possible solution? you are so right. i concede to the queen of bumper sticker politics. wonderful argument but that doesn't change the fact that SCHIP is about expanding federal health care and NOT about helping those poor kids. it's about encouraging young people to rely on the government for health insurance vs. saving, researching and buying the best insurance available.

What we probably CAN agree on is that there are MAJOR problems with the health insurance industry that need to be addressed.

The SCHIP Veto

Kevin of NJ — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 22:29:26 GMT

Carol

Thanks. We all misrepresent at times, and it is important to have all the facts correct. On all sides

The SCHIP Veto

Full Moon — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 22:33:01 GMT

Carol (Wednesday,October 3, 7:14PM) Your list of W's "accomplishments" can easily be challenged and/or debated. In fact, a negative list can be assembled for any president if one wants to take the time. If your bag is negativity then I suggest you support Air America and George Soros. He wallows in it.

The SCHIP Veto

Full Moon — Thu, 04 Oct 2007 22:56:33 GMT

C A - When I'm right you ALWAYS try to turn it around. Typical. I thought I was wrong once, but I was mistaken. Get it straight. Bush is still in charge when you swore he wouldn't be. 2008 isn't here yet. Don't get your hopes up. Whiner.

The SCHIP Veto

Full Moon — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 00:25:38 GMT

Clinton was the worst president we've had. An easy ride. The Cole. The World Trade Center bombings. He did nothing. Impeached. All his troubles were of his own doing. Lied so much that no one could keep up with it. Therefore Slick Willie.

Bush wins in 2000 even though the major networks aired that the poles were closed in Florida. The GOP had to call and remind them that a sizable part of Florida was in the Central Time Zone. Embarrassing.

Bush wins in 2004 when every liberal knew he wouldn't. Everyone blew that call. The lib rag mags and newspapers included.

The Dems win Congress in 2006 but can move. Pelosi's Posse and Harry Reid are so frustrated that they resort to smear campaigns aimed at conservative talk hosts. Hillary, the Dems only hope, agrees with Bush on many of his policies, insisting the war in Iraq will not end anytime soon.

Now I understand why most of you are the way you are.
All you have are each other. And that's tough enough.

The SCHIP Veto

Clyde, Anywhere USA — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 00:27:07 GMT

Vetoing the only palpable legislation in a decade,
denying our children health care, denying benefits to our veterans. This will directly result in the deaths of thousands of American Children. Their only crime will be that they were the son or daughter of a brave Iraq Veteran. Can there really be any doubt that Bush is the Antichrist?

The SCHIP Veto

Kevin of NJ — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 00:28:28 GMT

Carol (Wednesday,October 3, 7:14PM) Your list of W's "accomplishments" can easily be challenged and/or debated

I did write a lengthy rebuttal to Carol's list of accomplishment, and it doesn't show up here. Grrrrr. Maybe I should learn my lesson that this blog is not reliable, so I should save it in word. But I don't want my wife to think that I am having an online discussion with someone. :)

The SCHIP Veto

Carol, Long Valley NJ — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 01:10:14 GMT

Kevin of NJ (Sent Thursday, October 04, 2007 8:28 PM)

My "List of Accomplishments" was part of a humorous internet email of W's resume -- it was also kind of old. It was meant to spark discussion and it failed. It was also meant to get the 'right of center' folks to publish a positive list. So far no has been able to.

Don't do any really long posts, they are more likely to be 'omitted', 'dropped', 'censored' -- pick the verb of choice.

I would have enjoyed reading your rebuttal. I put all my posts in 'notepad' and keep them as my 'blog' file of the day.

The SCHIP Veto

junebug — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 02:10:40 GMT

Ah, Scott, you have comprehension problems, too. You need to meet Larry. Please read what I said. Twenty-two years (almost 23) in insurance defense litigation hardly makes me clueless.

And, sorry, but you're wrong about SCHIP, too, but you, like most ideologues will never, ever, ever, believe that you could possibly be wrong. You are.

BTW, I don't like bumper stickers, I think they are a bit foolish, and the only person I see who is spouting talking points here is you. Try reading the bill and quit listening to the talking heads. They speak with forked tongues.

The SCHIP Veto

C A, Tuscaloosa, AL — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 12:27:11 GMT

Full Moon (6:56 PM) 'Bush is still in charge". What a hoot. Bush has never been in charge of his senses. Funny Moon, if Bush and this administration needed no defending at all people like you and others wouldn't be here on this blog arguing with people. But you guys push and push hard. Why? Because there is plenty that Bush and this administration need defending about (or should I say excusing about). Problem is, you guys can't handle the truth. That's not whining, that's fact. Perhaps you need to go and find a sand box to play in. Your comments in here are childish.

Say Moon, if you are going to respond try and keep it short. Your 8:25 PM Post was rather long winded. Thanks

The SCHIP Veto

Gabriel, Clifton, New Jersey — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 13:17:14 GMT

Amazing! Regardless what the details are of this SCHIP program. All of a sudden W is worried about the price tag? Lol.. Let's see, the illegal war is up to how much now? And this program is how much? I think the penny pinching is too late Sir, you've already bankrupt us. Please leave us already!

The SCHIP Veto

Nadine Mackey — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 14:58:36 GMT

I believe the reason for the children's ages to extend to age 25 in the SCHIP extension bill is to include college students. After all, when we, as parents, fill out all of those financial aid forms, our kids are included as dependents through age 24. So all of you out there sputtering that the cigarette companies shouldn't have to pay for those in their early twenties, take a deep breath and chill.
The only people out to screw us are the Bushies, and they're doing a remarkable job.

The SCHIP Veto

Anna, Woodbridge, VA — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 23:04:33 GMT

Obviously this administration cares only for the unborn. Once you're out in the big wide world you are somebody else's problem. Just don't get sick...
It's just another example of how out of touch this administration is with the very people who pay their salaries. In our world if you don't do your job you can be fired. It's time we stop letting our employees get away with this.

The SCHIP Veto

Sandra Plush — Sat, 06 Oct 2007 20:24:47 GMT

When the President talks about a family earning $83,000 a year in the SCHIP program, he fails to mention that families with that income qualify only when they have nearly 10 children (each state has its own guidelines). Also, the SCHIP program fills the gap for many employer sponsored insurances that don't fully cover children with special health care needs (CHSCN). Without this piece, parents of these children could not work. Employer sponsored insurance has been cut back so much that it now makes supplemental policies necessary. Many employers support SCHIP because it saves them full cost of their employees' dependent insurance benefit. The new "consumer-driven health care plans" are high deductible, less coverage, and more cost to the employee if they want a total health care package for their family, with or without health problems.

The SCHIP Veto

Anna, Woodbridge, VA — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 16:38:26 GMT

When you object to coverage being extended to families making $83,000 per year, take a look at those areas where that figure is being quoted. I know in this area there has been a push for legislation requiring housing subsidies for teachers, because they can't afford to buy a home on a teacher's salary. So there are places in this country where you live hand to mouth on $83,000 a year.
This only gets worse if you are a single parent - especially with gas and food prices rising. In this wealthy country of ours it is an anathema that any child does not have a bed to sleep in, food to eat and simple health care - no matter what. Those Republicans who side with the White House need to start realizing that bush and his policies are sinking their party faster than the iceberg sank the Titanic – and just as surely. Try standing on the moral high ground, instead of the muck and mire of this administration.

The SCHIP Veto

Full Moon — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 13:52:22 GMT

The Colorado Rockies sweep Philadelphia. Jeff Gordon wins at Talladega BUT, to ruin the weekend, Hillary Clinton hires criminal Sandy Berger as part of her presidential campaign staff. And that's the way it is on Monday October 8, 2007, Columbus Day.

The SCHIP Veto

Full Moon — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 22:48:05 GMT

C A - You copy all my comments and are badly in need of a fresh approach. Think for yourself and don't use that Pammy intellect. It leans too far left.

The SCHIP Veto

Pam Bignardi, San Pedro, California — Tue, 09 Oct 2007 03:15:19 GMT

C A - Of course you can't and won't accept it but you're wrong. And should you feel an urge to answer this blog, try to keep it to a sentence or two. You are extremely long-winded.
Full Moon (Sent Thursday, October 04, 2007 3:43 PM)

No "Full-Of-It-Moon", it is you that is an oversized bag of hot air!!

The SCHIP Veto

Full Moon — Tue, 09 Oct 2007 16:58:22 GMT

Pammy - You said you wouldn't answer any more of my blogs, and this one wasn't directed at you. I was counting on you to be honest and true. And there you go, name-calling again. Larry was right. Give it a rest.

The SCHIP Veto

Curt Newsom — Thu, 11 Oct 2007 02:29:27 GMT

Would somebody with better assets and skills than I possess,please research what percentage of his life was GW covered by taxpayer funded or subsidized health insurance. I want 60% in the inevitible pool.